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Rob Arndt
Guest
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 Posted: Mon May 14, 2007 6:11 am Post subject: Sukhoi Su-9 and 11 |
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Su-9: http://avia.russian.ee/pictures/russia/su-9.jpg
Displaying a close conceptual similarity to the Messerschmitt Me 262,
the Su-9 single-seat fighter, also known as Samolet (Aircraft) K,
entered flight test in the autumn of 1946. Of all-metal construction
with a semi-monocoque, oval-section fuselage and single-spar wings,
the Su-9 had an armament of one 37mm and two 23mm cannon, and was
powered by two 900kg Junkers Jumo 004B turbojets (which had been
copied for manufacture in the Soviet Union as the RD-10). The Su-9
embodied a number of innovatory features insofar as Soviet technology
was concerned, these including hydraulically-boosted control surfaces,
a cordite-fired ejection seat, a variable-incidence tailplane,
provision for assisted take-off rockets and a braking parachute. Racks
under the centre fuselage permitted carriage of one 500kg or two 250kg
bombs. The Su-9 was shown publicly over Tushino on 3 August 1947, and
with completion of State testing in the following December, series
production was recommended. However, although possessing no more than
a superficial resemblance to the Me 262, its configurational
similarity to the German fighter was a stigma which led Yosif Stalin
to reject the Su-9 out of hand.
Su-11: http://avia.russian.ee/pictures/russia/su-11-1.jpg
In late May 1947, flight testing commenced of a development of the
Su-9, the Su-11 or Samolet LK, which was destined to be the first
Soviet jet fighter powered by a turbojet of indigenous design. The
fuselage of the Su-11 was fundamentally similar to that of the Su-9,
apart from some structural revision, but because of the appreciably
larger engines, the wing structure was extensively modified. The Su-11
was powered by two Lyulka TR-1 turbojets each developing 1300kg, these
being mounted ahead of the main-spar. Armament was the same as that of
the Su-9. Factory trials were completed in April 1948, but the TR-1
turbojet was inadequately developed and, like its predecessor, the
Su-11 was handicapped by the suggestion that it copied German
technology,. Aleksandr Yakovlev telling Yosif Stalin that it was no
more than a "warmed over Me 262".
Rob |
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Tankfixer
Guest
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| Posted: Tue May 15, 2007 6:12 am Post subject: Re: Sukhoi Su-9 and 11 |
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In article <1179159383.806128.231620 (AT) o5g2000hsb (DOT) googlegroups.com>,
teuton263 (AT) aol (DOT) com mumbled
| Quote: |
I count all my photos and info as a plus, not a minus. ALL information
is beneficial no matter where you get it IMO.
I have equally learned many things from this NG and I don't rely on
credits to absorb the needed information.
|
You are incorrect.
All info is not helpful if it is fabricated or distorted.
Giving credit for where information come from allows others to judge its
accuracy.
Do you think that intel agencies take info blindly without validating
the source ?
--
Usenetsaurus n. an early pedantic internet mammal, who survived on a
diet of static text and
cascading "threads." |
|
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Tankfixer
Guest
|
| Posted: Wed May 16, 2007 6:11 am Post subject: Re: Sukhoi Su-9 and 11 |
|
|
In article <1179209956.614785.146210 (AT) l77g2000hsb (DOT) googlegroups.com>,
teuton263 (AT) aol (DOT) com mumbled
| Quote: | On May 14, 10:33?pm, Tankfixer <paul.carr...@us.army.m> wrote:
In article <1179159383.806128.231...@o5g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
teuton...@aol.com mumbled
I count all my photos and info as a plus, not a minus. ALL information
is beneficial no matter where you get it IMO.
I have equally learned many things from this NG and I don't rely on
credits to absorb the needed information.
You are incorrect.
All info is not helpful if it is fabricated or distorted.
Giving credit for where information come from allows others to judge its
accuracy.
Do you think that intel agencies take info blindly without validating
the source ?
Like the US Intel agencies that came up with "WMDs in Iraq"
information that led to OIF?
Start citing reputable sources Tankfixer... oops, you can't, it was
all bullshit intelligence
|
Thank you for making my point.
Some of the sources they relied on turned out to be faulty.
But at least they know what they were.
| Quote: |
Fucking moron...
Rob
p.s. My dad WORKED WITH Intel guys and YES they do take (and pay for)
bad information all the time- they have to try EVERY angle, even bad
channels, to keep the flow of ALL information processing for
threats... and that IS good for the nation and the world.
|
I'm sure he did.
But then so have I over the course of my career.
| Quote: |
p.s.s. You may be good at fixing tanks, but you don't know shit about
intel.
|
I hope you footnote your books better than you provide sources here.
--
Usenetsaurus n. an early pedantic internet mammal, who survived on a
diet of static text and
cascading "threads." |
|
| Back to top |
|
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Tankfixer
Guest
|
| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 6:11 am Post subject: Re: Sukhoi Su-9 and 11 |
|
|
In article <1179458482.580921.139790 (AT) k79g2000hse (DOT) googlegroups.com>,
teuton263 (AT) aol (DOT) com mumbled
| Quote: | On May 17, 6:47?pm, Tankfixer <paul.carr...@us.army.m> wrote:
In article <464b321...@news.i70west.com>, d...@celticommnospam.com
mumbled
"Tankfixer" <paul.carr...@us.army.m> wrote in message
news:aXs2i.10303$Ut6.1626 (AT) newsread1 (DOT) news.pas.earthlink.net...
In article <1179209956.614785.146...@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
teuton...@aol.com mumbled
On May 14, 10:33?pm, Tankfixer <paul.carr...@us.army.m> wrote:
In article <1179159383.806128.231...@o5g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
teuton...@aol.com mumbled
I count all my photos and info as a plus, not a minus. ALL
information
is beneficial no matter where you get it IMO.
I have equally learned many things from this NG and I don't rely on
credits to absorb the needed information.
You are incorrect.
All info is not helpful if it is fabricated or distorted.
Giving credit for where information come from allows others to judge
its
accuracy.
Do you think that intel agencies take info blindly without validating
the source ?
Like the US Intel agencies that came up with "WMDs in Iraq"
information that led to OIF?
Start citing reputable sources Tankfixer... oops, you can't, it was
all bullshit intelligence
Thank you for making my point.
Some of the sources they relied on turned out to be faulty.
But at least they know what they were.
And just think, tinkerbell, Rob stuck up for you at one time. ?Guess he
figured out that you are just another wannabe. ?You might be a pro in tanks
but tanks don't fly well and never really made it off the drawing boards.
How could he figure that outr if he never was ?
Actually the tanks I know did make off drawing boards. Rob is the
champion of poaper designs.
This is Aircraft which you no less than nothing about.
I guess I shall be satisfied with my nothing then.
It puts me leagues ahead of you daryl.
P-38.
--
Usenetsaurus n. an early pedantic internet mammal, who survived on a
diet of static text and
cascading "threads."- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Just curious Tankfixer (and it is none of my business) but why does
Daryl call you "Tinkerbell"? Is that another NG story?
|
He has leaning I supose and is projecting I guess.
He thinks it is an insult.
But then his mind is around the second grade level so it suits him.
| Quote: |
Also, you have me pegged wrong on the "champion of paper designs"-
that would be Dan Johnson of Luftwaffe '46!
My posts as archived at RAM run into the thousands and cover all of
aviation from ancient designs up to the future and everything in
between. I am most known for my disc a/c and investigation of ultra-
rare types, prototypes, some paper designs (which would include US,
French, British, Russian, Italian, Japanese, etc...paper too), and
then a wide range of weird, odd, strange, and obscure types. But I
have also posted on commercial aviation, rotorcraft, spacecraft,
ultralights, UCAVs, UAVs, MAVs,... pretty much almost everything
possible- even ornithopters.
I think if you just run back several pages the vast majority of my
posts on a/c aren't even German dominated at all. A full spectrum of
world a/c from different time periods.
I really don;t follow your aviation posts Tankfixer so I won't comment
on them. Perhaps you can enlighten Daryl and the rest of us on what
aviation content best describes your interests...
|
Worked on an F-84 when I was 16.
Then a Hiller 23B.
Not to mention messing about with a few P&W radials.
But went crazy and joined the Army and ended up working on turret
sysyems and then gas turbine engines....
Before moving on to boring things
| Quote: | I think people just tend to remember any Nazi a/c I post- period, and
easily forget the higher ratio of non-German types I do post.
|
People remember you making excuses for the Nazi's
| Quote: |
Rob
p.s. The Russians and Japanese actually built and flew a flying tank,
and the US had one strange postwar design for a VTOL armored fighting
machine, but the concept was too radical and impractical. During the
Soviet war in Afghanistan there was a design for a Sukhoi aircraft/
tank combo- such was the outrage over the Mujahs in the mountains that
at one point shot down 1 Soviet aircraft per day using nothing more
than old Mausers, Enfields, recoilless guns, and vintage small arms.
And this was before they got Stingers!
|
--
Usenetsaurus n. an early pedantic internet mammal, who survived on a
diet of static text and
cascading "threads." |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Tankfixer
Guest
|
| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 6:11 am Post subject: Re: Sukhoi Su-9 and 11 |
|
|
In article <464b321a$1 (AT) news (DOT) i70west.com>, dhunt (AT) celticommnospam (DOT) com
mumbled
| Quote: |
"Tankfixer" <paul.carrier (AT) us (DOT) army.m> wrote in message
news:aXs2i.10303$Ut6.1626 (AT) newsread1 (DOT) news.pas.earthlink.net...
In article <1179209956.614785.146210 (AT) l77g2000hsb (DOT) googlegroups.com>,
teuton263 (AT) aol (DOT) com mumbled
On May 14, 10:33?pm, Tankfixer <paul.carr...@us.army.m> wrote:
In article <1179159383.806128.231...@o5g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
teuton...@aol.com mumbled
I count all my photos and info as a plus, not a minus. ALL
information
is beneficial no matter where you get it IMO.
I have equally learned many things from this NG and I don't rely on
credits to absorb the needed information.
You are incorrect.
All info is not helpful if it is fabricated or distorted.
Giving credit for where information come from allows others to judge
its
accuracy.
Do you think that intel agencies take info blindly without validating
the source ?
Like the US Intel agencies that came up with "WMDs in Iraq"
information that led to OIF?
Start citing reputable sources Tankfixer... oops, you can't, it was
all bullshit intelligence
Thank you for making my point.
Some of the sources they relied on turned out to be faulty.
But at least they know what they were.
And just think, tinkerbell, Rob stuck up for you at one time. Guess he
figured out that you are just another wannabe. You might be a pro in tanks
but tanks don't fly well and never really made it off the drawing boards.
|
How could he figure that outr if he never was ?
Actually the tanks I know did make off drawing boards. Rob is the
champion of poaper designs.
| Quote: | This is Aircraft which you no less than nothing about.
|
I guess I shall be satisfied with my nothing then.
It puts me leagues ahead of you daryl.
P-38.
--
Usenetsaurus n. an early pedantic internet mammal, who survived on a
diet of static text and
cascading "threads." |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Rob Arndt
Guest
|
| Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 6:11 am Post subject: Re: Sukhoi Su-9 and 11 |
|
|
On May 17, 6:47�pm, Tankfixer <paul.carr...@us.army.m> wrote:
| Quote: | In article <464b321...@news.i70west.com>, d...@celticommnospam.com
mumbled
"Tankfixer" <paul.carr...@us.army.m> wrote in message
news:aXs2i.10303$Ut6.1626 (AT) newsread1 (DOT) news.pas.earthlink.net...
In article <1179209956.614785.146...@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
teuton...@aol.com mumbled
On May 14, 10:33?pm, Tankfixer <paul.carr...@us.army.m> wrote:
In article <1179159383.806128.231...@o5g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
teuton...@aol.com mumbled
I count all my photos and info as a plus, not a minus. ALL
information
is beneficial no matter where you get it IMO.
I have equally learned many things from this NG and I don't rely on
credits to absorb the needed information.
You are incorrect.
All info is not helpful if it is fabricated or distorted.
Giving credit for where information come from allows others to judge
its
accuracy.
Do you think that intel agencies take info blindly without validating
the source ?
Like the US Intel agencies that came up with "WMDs in Iraq"
information that led to OIF?
Start citing reputable sources Tankfixer... oops, you can't, it was
all bullshit intelligence
Thank you for making my point.
Some of the sources they relied on turned out to be faulty.
But at least they know what they were.
And just think, tinkerbell, Rob stuck up for you at one time. Guess he
figured out that you are just another wannabe. You might be a pro in tanks
but tanks don't fly well and never really made it off the drawing boards.
How could he figure that outr if he never was ?
Actually the tanks I know did make off drawing boards. Rob is the
champion of poaper designs.
This is Aircraft which you no less than nothing about.
I guess I shall be satisfied with my nothing then.
It puts me leagues ahead of you daryl.
P-38.
--
Usenetsaurus n. an early pedantic internet mammal, who survived on a
diet of static text and
cascading "threads."- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
|
Just curious Tankfixer (and it is none of my business) but why does
Daryl call you "Tinkerbell"? Is that another NG story?
Also, you have me pegged wrong on the "champion of paper designs"-
that would be Dan Johnson of Luftwaffe '46!
My posts as archived at RAM run into the thousands and cover all of
aviation from ancient designs up to the future and everything in
between. I am most known for my disc a/c and investigation of ultra-
rare types, prototypes, some paper designs (which would include US,
French, British, Russian, Italian, Japanese, etc...paper too), and
then a wide range of weird, odd, strange, and obscure types. But I
have also posted on commercial aviation, rotorcraft, spacecraft,
ultralights, UCAVs, UAVs, MAVs,... pretty much almost everything
possible- even ornithopters.
I think if you just run back several pages the vast majority of my
posts on a/c aren't even German dominated at all. A full spectrum of
world a/c from different time periods.
I really don;t follow your aviation posts Tankfixer so I won't comment
on them. Perhaps you can enlighten Daryl and the rest of us on what
aviation content best describes your interests...
I think people just tend to remember any Nazi a/c I post- period, and
easily forget the higher ratio of non-German types I do post.
Rob
p.s. The Russians and Japanese actually built and flew a flying tank,
and the US had one strange postwar design for a VTOL armored fighting
machine, but the concept was too radical and impractical. During the
Soviet war in Afghanistan there was a design for a Sukhoi aircraft/
tank combo- such was the outrage over the Mujahs in the mountains that
at one point shot down 1 Soviet aircraft per day using nothing more
than old Mausers, Enfields, recoilless guns, and vintage small arms.
And this was before they got Stingers! |
|
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