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Brantly B2
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Murphy's law
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PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2004 12:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote



[email]n4mwd.dont.spam.me (AT) amsat (DOT) org[/email] wrote in message news:<40a0b7f0.1514550 (AT) rsnews (DOT) rapidsys.com>...
Quote:
David, you have a lot of gall to call me stupid. YOU ARE THE ONE WHO
IS STUPID AND DOESN'T KNOW WHAT HE IS TALKING ABOUT. I was at that
airport and saw the thing, WERE YOU THERE?. It was so overloaded that
the pilot had to take off like an airplane. It took him several
hundred feet to drag it on its skids fast enough to get enough
translational lift to get off the ground! According to the pilot,
this was reccommended proceedure when the gas tanks were full!

For your information, the guy in that flight (which you presume to be
an expert) did get off the ground and got half way out over the lake
when he realized that something was wrong. He never got more than
about 10 feet up. Then he turned back to the airport and got all the
way back to the shore of the lake before going plop. Another 20 feet
and he would have set down on dry land undamaged.

The pilot said that he was giving it maximum throttle. If the rpm
decayed, it was due to the craft and not the pilot. The on site FAA
guy said that it was overloaded.

David, I don't know what kind of idiot you are, but before you call
someone else stupid, you'd better get your facts straight.

Dennis H.

The facts of the crash
www.brantly.info
NTSB Report-May 2003, N2141U

Quote:
david (AT) datacustoms (DOT) com (helopilot) wrote:

Dennis, you're stupid and obviously don't know what you're talking
about. The helicopter was not overloaded on that flight. The guy
flying it let the RRPM decay beyond recovery, as can be done with any
helicopter. The Brantly is a good, reliable helicopter that can be
operated very reasonably. It's also no more cramped than any other
2-place helicopter, and actually has more room than the R22 and
certainly more than your rediculous scorpion.



[email]n4mwd.dont.spam.me (AT) amsat (DOT) org[/email] wrote in message news:<409d787d.3790659 (AT) rsnews (DOT) rapidsys.com>...
"Stu & Kathy Fields" <sfkf (AT) iwvisp (DOT) com> wrote:

The power/wt and hp/wt is as good or better than the Safari. But......

the brantly is a piece of junk. I'll take my scorpion over a brantly
any day.

BTW, the hub system on a brantley is a retarded attempt at a fully
articulated hub system. It has three heavy blades with the lead-lag
hinge about half way out on the blade. Its true, I'm not joking, the
blade hinges way out in the middle about 6 feet out.

No two-passenger helicopter should have been overloaded with those two
skinny guys in there. One was trapped underwater because the cockpit
is so cramped. Fortunately, he was able to pop the windscreen out and
escape through there.

Save your money and buy something besides a brantly.

Dennis H.


Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."

To find out what an H-1B is and how Congress is using
them to put Americans out of work, visit the following
web site and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news
video: http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm

Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."

To find out what an H-1B is and how Congress is using
them to put Americans out of work, visit the following
web site and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news
video: http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm



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n4mwd.dont.spam.me@amsat.
Guest





PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2004 4:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote




Here is the conclusion of the NTSB:

Quote:
The National Transportation Safety Board determines the
probable cause(s) of this accident as follows:

The pilot/owner's failure to maintain rotor rpm which
resulted in a loss of control. Contributing factors
were high gross weight and high density altitude.

In other words, it was overloaded. Saying the pilot was at fault is
not entirely true. His only fault was in buying a Brantly in the
first place. His inability to keep RPM up was not his ignorance, but
the failure of the helicopter to generate enough power. If you stop
and think about it, all helicopters crash because they failed to
maintain RPM. Its what caused the RPM to drop is what is important.

Dennis H.


[email]lfold (AT) aol (DOT) com[/email] (Murphy's law) wrote:

Quote:
The facts of the crash
www.brantly.info
NTSB Report-May 2003, N2141U


Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."

To find out what an H-1B is and how Congress is using
them to put Americans out of work, visit the following
web site and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news
video: http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm



Back to top
Stevenatherton
Guest





PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2004 7:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote

sorry denis ive flown a brantly its got the same power as a hiller / enstrom a
model or about twice the power of a rotorway no problems at all to keep the
rotor in the green
if a rororway can fly a brantly certainly can

steve
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Sla#s
Guest





PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2004 9:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote


"Steve R." <srhodes13 (AT) houston (DOT) rr.nospam.com> wrote

<SNIP>> Agreed! Especially in the case of something like the Brantly. I've
only
Quote:
seen a couple of them and like Dave, was struck (no pun intended!) by how
low the rotor was.

OTOH, as long as the pilot's sitting there with a firm hand on the cyclic
(keeping the disk level) and has eye contact with approaching / departing
ground personnel, it's not uncommon to load and unload passengers with the
rotor spinning. I'm not saying it's the safest thing in the world to do
but
by my admittedly limited experience, it's pretty common.


I worked as an engineer with Brantlys for ten years and went in and out of
the rotor disk many times a week. Never had a problem.
The trick - as with all helicopters - is to look for the tip path.

And as for the topic - Our guys used it for pipeline patrol and it was just
as good as any turbine. That rotor system is so smooth. - First time I flew
in another type I thought it was coming apart when it went into transition!

Slatts



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n4mwd.dont.spam.me@amsat.
Guest





PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2004 11:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote


I can't say that I have ever flown a Brantly, but here are some specs
from both Rotorway and Brantly's web site:

Helicopter Exec 162F Brantly B2B
===================== ================= ==================
Max level Speed 115 mph 100 mph
Cruise Speed 95 mph 90 mph
Rate of Climb 1000 fpm 1400 fpm
Service Ceiling 10000 feet 6000 feet
Hover IGE 7000 feet 3525 feet
Hover OGE 5000 feet n/a
Useful Load Capacity* 423 lbs 414 lbs
Fuel Burn ** 8.5 gph 13.8 gph
Max Range 180 miles 200 miles
Fuel Capacity 17 gal 31 gal (30.6 usable)

* With Full Tank of AvGas
** Calculated ((Cruise_Speed X Fuel_Capacity) / Range)

So at least according to the specs, the Exec outperforms the B2B in
everything execpt Rate of Climb and Max Range. Given the fuel burn is
nearly double in the B2B, it looks like it has to struggle to stay in
the air despite having a more powerful engine than the Exec.

Comparing to the R22: The R22 outperforms both with the exception of
max carrying load.

Dennis H.


[email]stevenatherton (AT) aol (DOT) comn[/email]ojunkm (Stevenatherton) wrote:

Quote:
sorry denis ive flown a brantly its got the same power as a hiller / enstrom a
model or about twice the power of a rotorway no problems at all to keep the
rotor in the green
if a rororway can fly a brantly certainly can

steve

Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."

To find out what an H-1B is and how Congress is using
them to put Americans out of work, visit the following
web site and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news
video: http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm



Back to top
Davdirect
Guest





PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2004 12:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote

I agree with you about watching the tip path, being careful, approaching from
the right place,etc. however to untrained passengers I could see where this
could be a problem, thats all.
Dave
davdirect
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helopilot
Guest





PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2004 1:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote

I've owned both the Exec 162F and the B2B. There were many times when
the RW had two adults and 3/4 fuel that it didn't have enough power to
maintain a hover. The RW does not out perform the Brantly in anything.
I liked the RW a lot and put 110 hours on mine. I've flown many times
in the Brantly with 400+ lbs in the cabin and full fuel with no
problems. There is no comparison really. I've also taken the Brantly
to 7100' and still had power to spare. The B2B doesn't struggle at all
to stay in the air. It flies beautifully.




[email]n4mwd.dont.spam.me (AT) amsat (DOT) org[/email] wrote in message news:<40a2a23f.1585527 (AT) rsnews (DOT) rapidsys.com>...
Quote:
I can't say that I have ever flown a Brantly, but here are some specs
from both Rotorway and Brantly's web site:

Helicopter Exec 162F Brantly B2B
===================== ================= ==================
Max level Speed 115 mph 100 mph
Cruise Speed 95 mph 90 mph
Rate of Climb 1000 fpm 1400 fpm
Service Ceiling 10000 feet 6000 feet
Hover IGE 7000 feet 3525 feet
Hover OGE 5000 feet n/a
Useful Load Capacity* 423 lbs 414 lbs
Fuel Burn ** 8.5 gph 13.8 gph
Max Range 180 miles 200 miles
Fuel Capacity 17 gal 31 gal (30.6 usable)

* With Full Tank of AvGas
** Calculated ((Cruise_Speed X Fuel_Capacity) / Range)

So at least according to the specs, the Exec outperforms the B2B in
everything execpt Rate of Climb and Max Range. Given the fuel burn is
nearly double in the B2B, it looks like it has to struggle to stay in
the air despite having a more powerful engine than the Exec.

Comparing to the R22: The R22 outperforms both with the exception of
max carrying load.

Dennis H.


[email]stevenatherton (AT) aol (DOT) comn[/email]ojunkm (Stevenatherton) wrote:

sorry denis ive flown a brantly its got the same power as a hiller / enstrom a
model or about twice the power of a rotorway no problems at all to keep the
rotor in the green
if a rororway can fly a brantly certainly can

steve

Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."

To find out what an H-1B is and how Congress is using
them to put Americans out of work, visit the following
web site and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news
video: http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm

Back to top
Murphy's law
Guest





PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2004 10:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote

[email]davdirect (AT) aol (DOT) com[/email] (Davdirect) wrote in message news:<20040513084956.13568.00001127 (AT) mb-m26 (DOT) aol.com>...
Quote:
I agree with you about watching the tip path, being careful, approaching from
the right place,etc. however to untrained passengers I could see where this
could be a problem, thats all.
Dave
davdirect

The PIC is always responsible for the safety of passengers & the safe
operation of the rotorcraft.
Placard in Brantly : ROTOR MUST BE STOPPED WHILE LOADING AND UNLOADING
PASSENGERS
Even so tip path plane is over 6 feet high, that's all folks

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n4mwd.dont.spam.me@amsat.
Guest





PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2004 11:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote


Some questions about the Brantly:

1) Does it hover OGE with a full load? The web site conspicuously
omits this common specification.

2) The pilot who owned the one that crashed said that the factory
reccommended running takeoffs when heavily loaded. Why is this? (I
said "dragging the skids down the runway" before, but on that day it
would be better described as "hopping.")

3) What type of engine is in your B2B? The B2B that crashed was
listed as a 1962 model Lycoming IO360. Maybe your engine is bigger.

4) I find it interesting that you claim that your B2B can outperform
the factory specs. Has your B2B had any special modifications wuch as
Fuel Injection, Supercharger, etc.?

Dennis H.


[email]david (AT) datacustoms (DOT) com[/email] (helopilot) wrote:

Quote:
I've owned both the Exec 162F and the B2B. There were many times when
the RW had two adults and 3/4 fuel that it didn't have enough power to
maintain a hover. The RW does not out perform the Brantly in anything.
I liked the RW a lot and put 110 hours on mine. I've flown many times
in the Brantly with 400+ lbs in the cabin and full fuel with no
problems. There is no comparison really. I've also taken the Brantly
to 7100' and still had power to spare. The B2B doesn't struggle at all
to stay in the air. It flies beautifully.




[email]n4mwd.dont.spam.me (AT) amsat (DOT) org[/email] wrote in message news:<40a2a23f.1585527 (AT) rsnews (DOT) rapidsys.com>...
I can't say that I have ever flown a Brantly, but here are some specs
from both Rotorway and Brantly's web site:

Helicopter Exec 162F Brantly B2B
===================== ================= ==================
Max level Speed 115 mph 100 mph
Cruise Speed 95 mph 90 mph
Rate of Climb 1000 fpm 1400 fpm
Service Ceiling 10000 feet 6000 feet
Hover IGE 7000 feet 3525 feet
Hover OGE 5000 feet n/a
Useful Load Capacity* 423 lbs 414 lbs
Fuel Burn ** 8.5 gph 13.8 gph
Max Range 180 miles 200 miles
Fuel Capacity 17 gal 31 gal (30.6 usable)

* With Full Tank of AvGas
** Calculated ((Cruise_Speed X Fuel_Capacity) / Range)

So at least according to the specs, the Exec outperforms the B2B in
everything execpt Rate of Climb and Max Range. Given the fuel burn is
nearly double in the B2B, it looks like it has to struggle to stay in
the air despite having a more powerful engine than the Exec.

Comparing to the R22: The R22 outperforms both with the exception of
max carrying load.

Dennis H.


[email]stevenatherton (AT) aol (DOT) comn[/email]ojunkm (Stevenatherton) wrote:

sorry denis ive flown a brantly its got the same power as a hiller / enstrom a
model or about twice the power of a rotorway no problems at all to keep the
rotor in the green
if a rororway can fly a brantly certainly can

steve

Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."

To find out what an H-1B is and how Congress is using
them to put Americans out of work, visit the following
web site and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news
video: http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm

Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."

To find out what an H-1B is and how Congress is using
them to put Americans out of work, visit the following
web site and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news
video: http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm



Back to top
Stu & Kathy Fields
Guest





PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2004 1:40 am    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote

One thing I noticed in the Brantly was that the rotor positioned so close to
the bubble could and did cause a very annoying flicker with the sun at the
right angle. A hat with a bill would be a must.
I agree with on poster the Brantly I flew was relatively smooth. I don't
think that they made the prettiest helo tho..More like a horizontal ice
cream cone. I remember a story Ken Brock told me about running out of power
with a passenger at a density altitude of about 3,500 but he was on a
pinnacle and didn't have all the ground effect he would have liked.. For my
money, if I was located at a place where the density altitude rarely got
above 4,000, I would consider the Brantly because it was so easy to fly.

Stu Fields Safari Driver.
"Murphy's law" <lfold (AT) aol (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:
davdirect (AT) aol (DOT) com (Davdirect) wrote in message
news:<20040513084956.13568.00001127 (AT) mb-m26 (DOT) aol.com>...
I agree with you about watching the tip path, being careful,
approaching from
the right place,etc. however to untrained passengers I could see where
this
could be a problem, thats all.
Dave
davdirect

The PIC is always responsible for the safety of passengers & the safe
operation of the rotorcraft.
Placard in Brantly : ROTOR MUST BE STOPPED WHILE LOADING AND UNLOADING
PASSENGERS
Even so tip path plane is over 6 feet high, that's all folks



Back to top
helopilot
Guest





PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2004 12:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote

1. Yes, depending on conditions (DA, wind, etc.)
2. Only reason I know of to do running takeoffs, besides practice, is
when you're loaded too heavy to maintain a hover. Many times I've been
fully loaded in the B2B and as long as the RRPM and wind is carefully
watched, I had no problems. Only once have I had to touch the skids
down a couple times until ETL was reached, at which point there was
ample power. It was a real hot summer day last year, 90%+ humidity,
fuel topped off, 430 lbs in the cabin, and probably 5 lbs in the
storage. I have no power complaints with the B2B at all.
3. The 360 fuel injected (Don't remember if that is the -A1A or -B1A).
The B2 and B2A ('62-'63 or so) had the carburator engine which I
understand does not have as much power as the fuel injected one used
now.
4. All standard B2B's have fuel injection. Mine has no mods to
increase power



[email]n4mwd.dont.spam.me (AT) amsat (DOT) org[/email] wrote in message news:<40a4040f.45579725 (AT) rsnews (DOT) rapidsys.com>...
Quote:
Some questions about the Brantly:

1) Does it hover OGE with a full load? The web site conspicuously
omits this common specification.

2) The pilot who owned the one that crashed said that the factory
reccommended running takeoffs when heavily loaded. Why is this? (I
said "dragging the skids down the runway" before, but on that day it
would be better described as "hopping.")

3) What type of engine is in your B2B? The B2B that crashed was
listed as a 1962 model Lycoming IO360. Maybe your engine is bigger.

4) I find it interesting that you claim that your B2B can outperform
the factory specs. Has your B2B had any special modifications wuch as
Fuel Injection, Supercharger, etc.?

Dennis H.


[email]david (AT) datacustoms (DOT) com[/email] (helopilot) wrote:

I've owned both the Exec 162F and the B2B. There were many times when
the RW had two adults and 3/4 fuel that it didn't have enough power to
maintain a hover. The RW does not out perform the Brantly in anything.
I liked the RW a lot and put 110 hours on mine. I've flown many times
in the Brantly with 400+ lbs in the cabin and full fuel with no
problems. There is no comparison really. I've also taken the Brantly
to 7100' and still had power to spare. The B2B doesn't struggle at all
to stay in the air. It flies beautifully.




[email]n4mwd.dont.spam.me (AT) amsat (DOT) org[/email] wrote in message news:<40a2a23f.1585527 (AT) rsnews (DOT) rapidsys.com>...
I can't say that I have ever flown a Brantly, but here are some specs
from both Rotorway and Brantly's web site:

Helicopter Exec 162F Brantly B2B
===================== ================= ==================
Max level Speed 115 mph 100 mph
Cruise Speed 95 mph 90 mph
Rate of Climb 1000 fpm 1400 fpm
Service Ceiling 10000 feet 6000 feet
Hover IGE 7000 feet 3525 feet
Hover OGE 5000 feet n/a
Useful Load Capacity* 423 lbs 414 lbs
Fuel Burn ** 8.5 gph 13.8 gph
Max Range 180 miles 200 miles
Fuel Capacity 17 gal 31 gal (30.6 usable)

* With Full Tank of AvGas
** Calculated ((Cruise_Speed X Fuel_Capacity) / Range)

So at least according to the specs, the Exec outperforms the B2B in
everything execpt Rate of Climb and Max Range. Given the fuel burn is
nearly double in the B2B, it looks like it has to struggle to stay in
the air despite having a more powerful engine than the Exec.

Comparing to the R22: The R22 outperforms both with the exception of
max carrying load.

Dennis H.



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n4mwd.dont.spam.me@amsat.
Guest





PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2004 2:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote


Stu,

I reccommend that you keep your Safari. I agree with you completely
about the Brantly looking like a flying Ice Cream Cone. It definitely
takes a lot of the fun out of flying when you know the people on the
ground are laughing at you, wondering if you have any Strawberry-Pecan
for sale. The only thing worse would be to fly in that hot-air
balloon that is shaped like Mickey Mouse.

I was stunned when I discovered that the B2B uses a vertically running
engine *despite* having at least three gearboxes. The Exec uses a
vertically running engine because it does not have a gearbox. I have
to say that I never realized that Lycoming even made a vertical
version of the O-360. I couldn't see well enough into the wreckage to
tell, but there was at least three gearboxes in the B2B. There were
two gearboxes on the tail boom. One was at the apex where it makes a
45 degree turn upward. The other was at the tail rotor.

This extra 45 degree gearbox seems to be a waste. It adds a lot of
extra weight and doesn't buy you anything. I will have to admit that
I was fascinated by the gearboxes themselves. They appeared to be
made out of 2" galvanized pipe elbows. I'm not sure if they really
were, but that's what they looked like.

I read the NTSB report about the crash and learned something. I
learned that the NTSB leaves out a lot of detail. We (myself and
other folks at the airport) were thinking maybe there was something
wrong with the engine which would explain the pilot not having enough
power to maintain a hover. The passenger weighed 190# which shouldn't
have been that excessive. Apparently, the NTSB never bothered to test
the engine and fuel systems as we had expected them to do.

According to the NTSB report, the pilot/owner said that the passenger
was flying the helicopter which caused it to crash. However, this is
not what I heard the passenger say. The passenger told me that he
never took the controls.

The pilot was an airline transport pilot with 28,000 flight hours and
over 100 hours in this particular B2B. I find it difficult to believe
that a pilot with this many hours would carelessly neglect to maintain
rotor RPM if he had a choice. Even if he did turn the controls over
to the passenger, a PIC with 28K hours would not allow the RPM to
decay like that. The tach is in plain sight.

Not to contradict myself, but I am truly interested in the facts that
surround this particular crash regardless of whether my opinion is
right or wrong. As such, I will have point out that the helicopter
crashed shortly after being refueled and that other people have had
trouble after refueling.

On 12/30/2003, a Cessna 441 crashed shortly after refueling at this
same airport. Then, a month later on 1/22/2004, another plane, this
time a Piper PA-23-160, also crashed after refueling. Both of these
accidents were fatal and had engine failure before hitting the ground.
Although, there was speculation about the fuel being bad, it was
tested and nothing was found. Not only that, but there were a lot of
other planes that used the same fuel and didn't crash. Nevertheless,
it still seems like there is more to it than a coincidence.

On another note, I would be curious as to how B2B's handle the weight
shift when a passenger is added. On an Exec, you have to move a
ballast weight depending on whether you have a passenger or not. On
the R22, it uses a high rotor level and geometry solves the problem.
On the B2B, you have a low rotor level and AFAIK no ballast weight.
How does the B2B do it? It this something inherrant to the 3 bladed
hub or does it simply have a large amount of cyclic?

Dennis H.




"Stu & Kathy Fields" <sfkf (AT) iwvisp (DOT) com> wrote:

Quote:
One thing I noticed in the Brantly was that the rotor positioned so close to
the bubble could and did cause a very annoying flicker with the sun at the
right angle. A hat with a bill would be a must.
I agree with on poster the Brantly I flew was relatively smooth. I don't
think that they made the prettiest helo tho..More like a horizontal ice
cream cone. I remember a story Ken Brock told me about running out of power
with a passenger at a density altitude of about 3,500 but he was on a
pinnacle and didn't have all the ground effect he would have liked.. For my
money, if I was located at a place where the density altitude rarely got
above 4,000, I would consider the Brantly because it was so easy to fly.

Stu Fields Safari Driver.
"Murphy's law" <lfold (AT) aol (DOT) com> wrote in message

Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."

To find out what an H-1B is and how Congress is using
them to put Americans out of work, visit the following
web site and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news
video: http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm



Back to top
Murphy's law
Guest





PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2004 2:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote

"Stu & Kathy Fields" <sfkf (AT) iwvisp (DOT) com> wrote

Quote:
One thing I noticed in the Brantly was that the rotor positioned so close to
the bubble could and did cause a very annoying flicker with the sun at the
right angle. A hat with a bill would be a must.
I agree with on poster the Brantly I flew was relatively smooth. I don't
think that they made the prettiest helo tho..More like a horizontal ice
cream cone. I remember a story Ken Brock told me about running out of power
with a passenger at a density altitude of about 3,500 but he was on a
pinnacle and didn't have all the ground effect he would have liked.. For my
money, if I was located at a place where the density altitude rarely got
above 4,000, I would consider the Brantly because it was so easy to fly.

In any bubble type plexi cabin a some kind of sunvisor is a must to
block sunglare
I had a Rotorway Exec 90, a Safari, have an R22, a Brantly B2, so I
know the difference
The Brantly is kid'a funny looking, but the beauty is in the eye of
the beholder
As the matter of fact, the cone shaped fuselage is an airstream
stabilizer
The flying characteristics must be the main concern in any aircraft


Quote:
Stu Fields Safari Driver.
"Murphy's law" <lfold (AT) aol (DOT) com> wrote in message
news:ffe926be.0405131456.5e9138c1 (AT) posting (DOT) google.com...
[email]davdirect (AT) aol (DOT) com[/email] (Davdirect) wrote in message
news:<20040513084956.13568.00001127 (AT) mb-m26 (DOT) aol.com>...
I agree with you about watching the tip path, being careful,
approaching from
the right place,etc. however to untrained passengers I could see where
this
could be a problem, thats all.
Dave
davdirect

The PIC is always responsible for the safety of passengers & the safe
operation of the rotorcraft.
Placard in Brantly : ROTOR MUST BE STOPPED WHILE LOADING AND UNLOADING
PASSENGERS
Even so tip path plane is over 6 feet high, that's all folks

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Gary Knutson
Guest





PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2004 4:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote



[email]n4mwd.dont.spam.me (AT) amsat (DOT) org[/email] wrote:

Quote:
I was stunned when I discovered that the B2B uses a vertically running
engine *despite* having at least three gearboxes. The Exec uses a
vertically running engine because it does not have a gearbox.

So, you're telling us that the Exec rotor runs at engine speed?

Quote:
I have to say that I never realized that Lycoming even made a vertical
version of the O-360.

And, you are also telling us you've never seen a Bell 47 (not the ones
with the Franklin)?

Gary



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n4mwd.dont.spam.me@amsat.
Guest





PostPosted: Fri May 14, 2004 9:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Brantly B2 Reply with quote

Gary Knutson <glkd (AT) cox (DOT) net> wrote:

Quote:
n4mwd.dont.spam.me (AT) amsat (DOT) org wrote:

I was stunned when I discovered that the B2B uses a vertically running
engine *despite* having at least three gearboxes. The Exec uses a
vertically running engine because it does not have a gearbox.

So, you're telling us that the Exec rotor runs at engine speed?

No, I didn't say that at all. The exec has no gearboxes at all. Not
even a tail rotor gearbox.

Quote:

I have to say that I never realized that Lycoming even made a vertical
version of the O-360.

And, you are also telling us you've never seen a Bell 47 (not the ones
with the Franklin)?

I am saying that I have never seen under the covers of a Bell 47 so I
don't have a clue what's under there. Apparently helicopters with
vertical engines are more common than I thought. However, it still
seems kind of silly when there is a gearbox being used that could
easily convert the direction.

Dennis H.





Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."

To find out what an H-1B is and how Congress is using
them to put Americans out of work, visit the following
web site and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news
video: http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm



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