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Bryan Mason · Guest

Hi all,

I'm nearing the 20 hour mark and am working on landings (well, they're
supposed to be landings but . . . well . . . lets just say I'm
thankful for sturdy landing gear).

I'm getting better at sideslipping during descent, but my instructor
and I have noticed some things that I'm doing on landing that are
really messing things up.

1) Too slow on approach (tendency to pull the yoke back as I get
closer to the ground).
2) Pulling back quickly on the level-off, causing a flare way too
early, with the resulting fun that happens after that.
3) Ending up on the left side of the runway and many times yawing to
the left.

I'm thinking that maybe 1 and 2 is caused by ground shyness. With the
nose down on what would probably be a proper approach, as we get down
close to the ground, it feels like I'm going to ram the nose of the
airplane into the ground. I know that I'm not (at least I know my
instructor will intervene before it gets to that point), but it makes
me very nervous. I'm unconciously pulling back on the yoke and don't
notice it until my instructor says "too slow -- nose down."

Anybody have any hints -- mental tricks if you will -- to get over
ground shyness. Or is it just do it over and over and I'll get used
to it.

Also, anybody have any idea about #3. It seems like I'm lined up and
everything, and next thing I know, I'm on the left side of the runway
again.

For the record, I'm flying a Piper Warrior II.

Mark Hansen · Guest

On 10/20/2004 09:10, Bryan Mason <bmason

Gary Drescher · Guest

"Bryan Mason bmason com>" <bmason

kontiki · Guest

Keep flying the airplane all the way. It's not uncommon that
students forget about flying the aiplane when they are close
to the ground... hoping things will sort of work out. Keep
flying it until you are into ground effect then ease off the
throttle as you shift your gaze to the far end of the runway.
Try to "keep it flying" with the power off it until it will
tend to gracefully settle itself onto the runway.

Later when you have to land in windy/gusty conditions you'll
have to modify the amount of power you use (or ease off) as
you get close to the runway in order to maintain more positive
control, but that will come in time.

C J Campbell · Guest

We call it "fear of runway." (I don't know what phobia that is; whatever the
Greek word is for runway + phobia, suppose.) Anyway, it goes away with time
and practice.

Brien K. Meehan · Guest

Bryan Mason wrote:

Bryan Mason · Guest

On 20 Oct 2004 13:16:27 -0700, "Brien K. Meehan"
<brien (AT) networkgenius (DOT) com> wrote:

mhquay · Guest

From one student pilot (just over 40 hours) to another.

I am sure every pilot has this fear when close to the ground and I
would bet that many licensed pilots probably have an increase in
heart-rate when landing as well.

There is only one fix.... Lots of practice.

The more landings you do the more relaxed you will become. This will
also solve your other landing problems as you will be able to "feel"
the time to flare and will perform the manouvre with finesse rather
than jerky movements and will notice drift etc earlier and be able to
apply the appropriate correction.

Remember that the landing procedure starts when you join the circuit.
Get your airspeed, attitude and trim right on base and final and the
aircraft will do most of the work for you.
My father-in-law (40 years experience) told me, when I started
learning. not to forget that the aircraft is just a machine and you are
the boss. If it wants to drift or sink don't let it!

Good Luck.

Phil

--
mhquay
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted via OziPilots Online [ http://www.OziPilotsOnline.com.au ]
- A website for Australian Pilots regardless of when, why, or what they fly -

BTIZ · Guest

have the instructor get you down to about 5ft above the runway at approach
speed and apply enough power to fly the length of the runway.. concentrate
on maintaining the set altitude and the centerline.. do it 3 to 4 times.. a
little lower each time.. then it's just a matter of losing that last 1ft of
altitude and pulling the power back to land..

just a thought

BT

"Bryan Mason bmason com>" <bmason

Chris · Guest

Pavan Bhatnagar · Guest

Bryan Mason <bmason wrote

Hi Bryan - you have already identified the reason for 1 & 2.

Point 3 - ending up on the left - is likely because you are trying to
put the centerline *between* yourself & the instructor.
Don't do that - aim to put *yourself* over the centerline.
I'm sure a quick think will self-illumibate the reason for this :)

best
Pavan.

Jay Beckman · Guest

"Bryan Mason bmason com>" <bmason

Pete · Guest

I'm sure the professionals on here will have some expert advice on
this but the following are things I look out for.

- A good set up on turning crosswind and on to finals really helps.
Getting the airspeed right at these points certainly helps lead
towards a good landing. Agree the right airspeed with the instructor
(and instruction book).

- The transition from coming in on the landing to going parallel with
the runway (the flare) is the trickiest bit for me. I've focused on it
being a more gradual transition rather than switching from state A to
state B immediately. Shifting gaze to the end of the runway enables me
to see my attitude better. Looking at the end of the runway I can
assess if I'm raising or falling in height. The aim being to fly
parallel for as long as possible without actually landing. As I sense
I'm loosing height I pull back on the stick, but not enough to start
taking off again. If I sense I'm going to take off again (cause I
pulled back to much) I'll keep the stick still before commencing to
pull back more and more.

- When everything is right you'll be pulling further and further back
with the stall warner sounding and you'll avoid the landing on three
wheels.

- Sitting in the aircraft and just learning the attitude it sits on
the tarmac helps you recognise the attitude you should be looking for
during the landing, but slightly nose up of course.

- When you do pull back too much and balloon, hold the stick still but
make judgment as to whether more throttle is required to stop hitting
the runway hard and turning into a bouncer.

- Making sure the throttle is fully back is important.

I'm certainly no expert and look forward to others comments on this so
I too can hopefully make that lovely soft landing more often

Dave · Guest

Bryan,

I am getting to the solo point myself and the landings are out of the way
pretty much. I fly a Cessna so this may be a moot point, and I acknowledge
that my issues may not be the same as you describe, but maybe this helps. I
had the same problems under two conditions.

1. When I was descending towards a point that I thought was the _before_ the
threshold of the runway (the Numbers). When I got real close it became more
apparent that I was not going to make the runway at my current rate of
decent and the first reaction was to lift the nose. That of course has been
dealt with by using and trusting the method of halting or slowing the decent
with more power.
I don't know about your airport but the runways at mine have the ILS aiming
point painted on them. I now set my own personal aiming point 1/4 of the
way up from the numbers as referenced by the ILS aiming point.
This gives me the comfort zone of not having to worry so much about not
making the runway at all. I use the freed up "brain cycles" to get a nice
looking decent instead of worrying about dropping it in on the Parkway.

And I say "Nice looking decent" because I can maneuver the plane in such a
way that I don't need to cut power and drop the nose to start the landing.
And that brings me to point two

2. My instructor had me practice landings by descending to 400feet, using
power to level off at 400 feet then get up to the threshold and cut the
power.
Well that was fun but I had to figure out on my own that you don't have to
be so high all the time over the threshold or always cut the power and drop
that nose every time. The idea is to use all the knowledge to make a
landing. So now I have a nice decent set up so that I don't get too low,
that also doesn't require such a dramatic nose down final. I gently roll
off the power and I can "feel" the flare. I don't know if this makes sense
or not; quickly cutting the power requires a quick nose down. A more gentle
power cut and I am with the flare all the way. Maybe it's just me.

Lastly, I believe that I have subconsciously been doing something that
another poster said in this thread. That is looking beyond the nose of the
aircraft to keep the runway centered. Looking beyond the nose will also
keep you from drawing the imaginary line that points straight through the
nose in into the ground.

--
Dave A
Aging Student Pilot
KFRG

"Bryan Mason bmason com>" <bmason

James M. Knox · Guest

Bryan Mason <bmason wrote in
news:6p2dn0l02b7ivca62nqdrfsouk23243l8v (AT) 4ax (DOT) com: