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Marc Chametzky
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 Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 3:28 am Post subject: Great landing progress! |
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After all the bad weather we've had in southern California, I finally got a
chance to go up and do some more landing practice. I had a different
instructor (mine was sick), so it was good to get a different point of view.
I think I found one of the key places where I was having problems. I wasn't
paying enough attention to the airspeed as I was getting close to landing.
Today, I paid much more attention to trying to get in level flight above the
ground at 60 knots, and I had much, much better performance! Most of the
landings today were pretty good.
I need to refine my landings more, of course, but I'm happy that they don't
feel like the plane is plummeting those last few feet.
One thing that the instructor said was that in the Cessna 172, he usually only
goes 30 degrees of flaps, not the full 40. My regular instructor advises full
flaps for landing. Does anyone have an explanation for why one should use 30
instead of 40?
--Marc
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Ben Jackson
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| Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 4:05 am Post subject: Re: Great landing progress! |
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In article <403c1662$1 (AT) baja (DOT) bluevine.net>,
Marc Chametzky <marc+spam (AT) bluevine (DOT) net> wrote:
| Quote: | One thing that the instructor said was that in the Cessna 172, he usually only
goes 30 degrees of flaps, not the full 40. My regular instructor advises full
flaps for landing. Does anyone have an explanation for why one should use 30
instead of 40?
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Better go around performance. And a lot of 172s only have 30, so I guess
you should at least try it that way! I learned in a 172 with 30 to fly
a formula of 10 on downwind, 20 on baes, 30 on final. When I've flown
with 40 I just used it to adjust my glideslope.
--
Ben Jackson
<ben (AT) ben (DOT) com>
http://www.ben.com/
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Paul Folbrecht
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| Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 4:36 am Post subject: Re: Great landing progress! |
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The 172s I rent have only 30.. holy crap, I can barely imagine the
amount of drag you must get with 40. 30 degrees and idle power sure
gets you down in a hurry.
To answer your question, 40 might be handy for those situations where
you REALLY want to get down & stopped fast and/or at the lowest possible
groundspeed (short and/or soft fields), but in the normal case there
really should not be much need. I normally use 20 degrees in both the
172 and 152 (10 degrees if it's really gusty), and even if you're a bit
sloppy you don't really need a lot of runway in that configuration.
~Paul
~PP-SEL
Ben Jackson wrote:
| Quote: | In article <403c1662$1 (AT) baja (DOT) bluevine.net>,
Marc Chametzky <marc+spam (AT) bluevine (DOT) net> wrote:
One thing that the instructor said was that in the Cessna 172, he usually only
goes 30 degrees of flaps, not the full 40. My regular instructor advises full
flaps for landing. Does anyone have an explanation for why one should use 30
instead of 40?
Better go around performance. And a lot of 172s only have 30, so I guess
you should at least try it that way! I learned in a 172 with 30 to fly
a formula of 10 on downwind, 20 on baes, 30 on final. When I've flown
with 40 I just used it to adjust my glideslope.
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nooneimportant
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 4:49 am Post subject: Re: Great landing progress! |
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"Marc Chametzky" <marc+spam (AT) bluevine (DOT) net> wrote
| Quote: | After all the bad weather we've had in southern California, I finally got
a
chance to go up and do some more landing practice. I had a different
instructor (mine was sick), so it was good to get a different point of
view.
I think I found one of the key places where I was having problems. I
wasn't
paying enough attention to the airspeed as I was getting close to landing.
Today, I paid much more attention to trying to get in level flight above
the
ground at 60 knots, and I had much, much better performance! Most of the
landings today were pretty good.
I need to refine my landings more, of course, but I'm happy that they
don't
feel like the plane is plummeting those last few feet.
One thing that the instructor said was that in the Cessna 172, he usually
only
goes 30 degrees of flaps, not the full 40. My regular instructor advises
full
flaps for landing. Does anyone have an explanation for why one should use
30
instead of 40?
--Marc
|
I follow the "As Needed" Rule for the last of the flaps. Its been
windy/gusty lately so ive been using only 20deg of flaps for most landings,
only using 30 when i find myself higher than i want to be, but in calm winds
i will use the full 30 most of the time.. when i fly the N model that has
the full 40deg flaps I typically use the 30, and only add the 40 if needed
to steepen glideslope or for short field practice... AMAZING how quickly you
can touch and stop with 40deg of flaps if you really tried! My instructor
prefers to use 30 in all but gusty conditions, but if i've got 20 out and
everything is looking good i don't see much need to put out 30, all it will
do is steepen the approach and may need a bit of power to move the TD a bit
down the runway... My typical landing consists of CarbHeat/1500 RPM abeam
the numbers, pitch for 80 and extend 10 flaps, by the time thats done runway
should be 45deg off shoulder so i turn base, flaps to 20, pitch for 75
(typically get a 500fpm decent at that point). When appropriate turn to
final and pitch for wind... 70 for calm/steady winds, 75 for gusty/xwind,
and add flaps to 30 IF NEEDED, if not continue approach, round out, flare,
hold it holdit holdit holdit chirp.... TD usually occurs between 45-60kts
with stall horn screaming like a wet cat, depending on how much extra speed
i carried in preparation for "Unexpected Extras" like surface winds/gusts.
I've never noticed a significant difference between the float between
20/30deg, nor landing distance. I do notice that with only 20 deg its MUCH
easier to correct for xwind for some reason (I use the mild slip version of
correction VS the crab/kickout) But may crab depending on conditions till
about 100 agl where i transition to the "Mild Slip" idea. I'm at the point
in my training now that I am consistant with "squeakers" notice i said NOT
CONSTANT, don't think anyone can ALWAYS manage a squeaker, and i still get
the occasional "Unexpected Extra" at touchdown. Bigest one I've had the
last couple of times has been a wind gust right when the mains should touch
down and finding myself pushed back up to 20' or so... amazing what just a
little bit of power can do to soften the blow from that one! (Just like a
soft field, add just enough power to hear the change and it will convert a
tooth chipper to a mere kidney puncher, think with a bit more power i could
have had a "normal" touchdown).
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