AirTalk.org Aviation discussions newsgroups   Archives   FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Register   Profile   Log in to check your private messages   Log in  ELT's read.          AirTalk.org Forum Index -> Sailplanes View previous topic :: View next topic   Author Message Tomnkeylargo@aol.com Guest Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 3:52 pm    Post subject: ELT's read. DISCONTINUANCE OF 121.5 & 243 MHz FOR SATELLITE DISTRESS ALERTS The Cospas-Sarsat Program has announced plans to terminate satellite processing of distress signals from 121.5 and 243 MHz emergency beacons on February 1, 2009. Users of the system will have to switch to emergency beacons operating at 406 MHz, which are more reliable and provide search and rescue agencies complete information that they need to do their job, in order to be detected by satellites. Reasons for the Cospas-Sarsat program to discontinue use are driven by guidance from the International Maritime Organization (IMO) and the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO). These two agencies are responsible for regulating the safety of ships and aircraft on international transits and handle international standards for maritime and aeronautical search and rescue missions. In addition, 121.5 MHz false alerts inundate search and rescue resources which impact the effectiveness of lifesaving services. Individuals who plan on buying a new distress beacon may wish to take the Cospas-Sarsat decision into account. For further information please see www.sarsat.noaa.gov. Back to top M B Guest Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 7:07 pm    Post subject: Re: ELT's read. This is a translation for those who don't interpret gobbledygook well: The guys who watch 121.5 aren't going to do it any more three years from now. If you have an aircraft ELT, it must be the kind that give the exact point of impact. These new 406MHz ELTs send the exact GPS point of impact. The folks who do search and rescue want this change. The old ELTs took a long time to find, and needed special radios to steer to the signal. The old ELTs also did not tell which exact aircraft they were attached to. Rescuers think spending a long time and doing a lot of special radio training costs too much. Instead, it is better if aircraft owners pay more for modern ELTs. Also, very, very few aircraft ELT alerts are of any use for rescue. In almost every case, the people are either 1) dead by the time they are found, 2) able to find help some other way (cell phone, people running up, handheld radio), or 3) are well enough to walk away on their own. Many rescuers say that after ten years and thousands of ELT alerts, they have found only false alarms or dead people. This costs a lot of money. Think before you buy a 121.5 ELT and install it. You might want to wait until the 406MHz units are more common. Then the price may be lower because everyone has to buy them. GPS makers like Garmin might sell cheap 406MHz ELTs. Install one of these obsolete 121.5 ELTs just for 3 years of contests. Or buy and install a 406MHz ELT. If you can't afford it, then you can't fly in a contest. Even Sport's class over flat terrain in a 1-26 within 10 miles requires an ELT. That's the rule in USA contests. Quote: DISCONTINUANCE OF 121.5 & 243 MHz FOR SATELLITE DISTRESS ALERTS The Cospas-Sarsat Program has announced plans to terminate satellite processing of distress signals from 121.5 and 243 MHz emergency beacons on February 1, 2009. Users of the system will have to switch to emergency beacons operating at 406 MHz, which are more reliable and provide search and rescue agencies complete information that they need to do their job, in order to be detected by satellites. Reasons for the Cospas-Sarsat program to discontinue use are driven by guidance from the International Maritime Organization (IMO) and the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO). These two agencies are responsible for regulating the safety of ships and aircraft on international transits and handle international standards for maritime and aeronautical search and rescue missions. In addition, 121.5 MHz false alerts inundate search and rescue resources which impact the effectiveness of lifesaving services. Individuals who plan on buying a new distress beacon may wish to take the Cospas-Sarsat decision into account. For further information please see www.sarsat.noaa.gov. Mark J. Boyd Back to top basils27 Guest Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 8:20 pm    Post subject: Re: ELT's read. Fly your contest in the UK (the land of the free). We don't have such silly rules. Basil "M B" <REMOVE_TO_REPLY.mjboyd (AT) ucsc (DOT) edu> wrote Quote: This is a translation for those who don't interpret gobbledygook well: The guys who watch 121.5 aren't going to do it any more three years from now. If you have an aircraft ELT, it must be the kind that give the exact point of impact. These new 406MHz ELTs send the exact GPS point of impact. The folks who do search and rescue want this change. The old ELTs took a long time to find, and needed special radios to steer to the signal. The old ELTs also did not tell which exact aircraft they were attached to. Rescuers think spending a long time and doing a lot of special radio training costs too much. Instead, it is better if aircraft owners pay more for modern ELTs. Also, very, very few aircraft ELT alerts are of any use for rescue. In almost every case, the people are either 1) dead by the time they are found, 2) able to find help some other way (cell phone, people running up, handheld radio), or 3) are well enough to walk away on their own. Many rescuers say that after ten years and thousands of ELT alerts, they have found only false alarms or dead people. This costs a lot of money. Think before you buy a 121.5 ELT and install it. You might want to wait until the 406MHz units are more common. Then the price may be lower because everyone has to buy them. GPS makers like Garmin might sell cheap 406MHz ELTs. Install one of these obsolete 121.5 ELTs just for 3 years of contests. Or buy and install a 406MHz ELT. If you can't afford it, then you can't fly in a contest. Even Sport's class over flat terrain in a 1-26 within 10 miles requires an ELT. That's the rule in USA contests. DISCONTINUANCE OF 121.5 & 243 MHz FOR SATELLITE DISTRESS ALERTS The Cospas-Sarsat Program has announced plans to terminate satellite processing of distress signals from 121.5 and 243 MHz emergency beacons on February 1, 2009. Users of the system will have to switch to emergency beacons operating at 406 MHz, which are more reliable and provide search and rescue agencies complete information that they need to do their job, in order to be detected by satellites. Reasons for the Cospas-Sarsat program to discontinue use are driven by guidance from the International Maritime Organization (IMO) and the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO). These two agencies are responsible for regulating the safety of ships and aircraft on international transits and handle international standards for maritime and aeronautical search and rescue missions. In addition, 121.5 MHz false alerts inundate search and rescue resources which impact the effectiveness of lifesaving services. Individuals who plan on buying a new distress beacon may wish to take the Cospas-Sarsat decision into account. For further information please see www.sarsat.noaa.gov. Mark J. Boyd Back to top Don Johnstone Guest Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 8:49 pm    Post subject: Re: ELT's read. It should also be noted that this switch off only effects the USA. The rest of the world could, if we felt the need to use ELTs, continue with the old frequencies. That's progress? At 20:24 05 September 2005, Basils27 wrote: Quote: Fly your contest in the UK (the land of the free). We don't have such silly rules. Basil 'M B' wrote in message news:3o3janF43kjpU1 (AT) individual (DOT) net... This is a translation for those who don't interpret gobbledygook well: The guys who watch 121.5 aren't going to do it any more three years from now. If you have an aircraft ELT, it must be the kind that give the exact point of impact. These new 406MHz ELTs send the exact GPS point of impact. The folks who do search and rescue want this change. The old ELTs took a long time to find, and needed special radios to steer to the signal. The old ELTs also did not tell which exact aircraft they were attached to. Rescuers think spending a long time and doing a lot of special radio training costs too much. Instead, it is better if aircraft owners pay more for modern ELTs. Also, very, very few aircraft ELT alerts are of any use for rescue. In almost every case, the people are either 1) dead by the time they are found, 2) able to find help some other way (cell phone, people running up, handheld radio), or 3) are well enough to walk away on their own. Many rescuers say that after ten years and thousands of ELT alerts, they have found only false alarms or dead people. This costs a lot of money. Think before you buy a 121.5 ELT and install it. You might want to wait until the 406MHz units are more common. Then the price may be lower because everyone has to buy them. GPS makers like Garmin might sell cheap 406MHz ELTs. Install one of these obsolete 121.5 ELTs just for 3 years of contests. Or buy and install a 406MHz ELT. If you can't afford it, then you can't fly in a contest. Even Sport's class over flat terrain in a 1-26 within 10 miles requires an ELT. That's the rule in USA contests. DISCONTINUANCE OF 121.5 & 243 MHz FOR SATELLITE DISTRESS ALERTS The Cospas-Sarsat Program has announced plans to terminate satellite processing of distress signals from 121.5 and 243 MHz emergency beacons on February 1, 2009. Users of the system will have to switch to emergency beacons operating at 406 MHz, which are more reliable and provide search and rescue agencies complete information that they need to do their job, in order to be detected by satellites. Reasons for the Cospas-Sarsat program to discontinue use are driven by guidance from the International Maritime Organization (IMO) and the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO). These two agencies are responsible for regulating the safety of ships and aircraft on international transits and handle international standards for maritime and aeronautical search and rescue missions. In addition, 121.5 MHz false alerts inundate search and rescue resources which impact the effectiveness of lifesaving services. Individuals who plan on buying a new distress beacon may wish to take the Cospas-Sarsat decision into account. For further information please see www.sarsat.noaa.gov. Mark J. Boyd Back to top 2cernauta2 Guest Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 11:59 pm    Post subject: Re: ELT's read. Don Johnstone <REMOVE_TO_REPLY.donjay401-gpnet (AT) yahoo (DOT) co.uk> wrote: Quote: It should also be noted that this switch off only effects the USA. The rest of the world could, if we felt the need to use ELTs, continue with the old frequencies. That's progress? As I understand it, the old frequencies will still be listened to, in the search of an aircraft that is known to be missing and equipped. The difference from the current period is that an old ELT will NOT trigger an SAR alarm by itself. Somehow the SAR services will first have to be alerted by someone reporting a missing plane. A friend of mine has already owned a 406MHz ELT since 2000. He's now facing the programmed Li-ion battery renewal. He's going to spend over 400 USD (certification of the battery, and of the workshop, plus shipping). DIY and cheaper spares not available. Aldo Cernezzi Back to top tfdixon@msn.com Guest Posted: Tue Sep 06, 2005 3:22 am    Post subject: Re: ELT's read. I want to point out, for the second time this summer, that the Cometition Rules Committee made this requirement- All sailplanes participating in SSA sanctioned contests from 2006 on, will be required to have ELT's... This is not the exact wording of the rule but you can check out the rules for yourself. This rule was made when well over a half of the respondents to the annual survey said they did not want this requirement added. Go figure! And please John G. don't tell us again how this has been a lifesaving tool at contests and how important it is to know where the crash is for the family's sake. We have gone years with out this and the instances where it was of any benefit, if I remember correctly, can be counted on just a few fingers and I don't remeber if any lives were saved. Tom Dixon Idaho 2cernauta2 wrote: Quote: Don Johnstone <REMOVE_TO_REPLY.donjay401-gpnet (AT) yahoo (DOT) co.uk> wrote: It should also be noted that this switch off only effects the USA. The rest of the world could, if we felt the need to use ELTs, continue with the old frequencies. That's progress? As I understand it, the old frequencies will still be listened to, in the search of an aircraft that is known to be missing and equipped. The difference from the current period is that an old ELT will NOT trigger an SAR alarm by itself. Somehow the SAR services will first have to be alerted by someone reporting a missing plane. A friend of mine has already owned a 406MHz ELT since 2000. He's now facing the programmed Li-ion battery renewal. He's going to spend over 400 USD (certification of the battery, and of the workshop, plus shipping). DIY and cheaper spares not available. Aldo Cernezzi Back to top Eric Greenwell Guest Posted: Thu Sep 08, 2005 3:06 am    Post subject: Re: ELT's read. Don Johnstone wrote: Quote: It should also be noted that this switch off only effects the USA. The rest of the world could, if we felt the need to use ELTs, continue with the old frequencies. That's progress? My understanding is the 121.5 mhz ELT monitoring change was international. Are you saying the rest of the world will be using something besides the Cospas-Sarsat satellites to monitor ELT's? This is part of what was posted previously: Quote: Reasons for the Cospas-Sarsat program to discontinue use are driven by guidance from the International Maritime Organization (IMO) and the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) These sound like international organizations, not USA agencies. -- Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly Eric Greenwell Washington State USA Back to top Display posts from previous: All Posts1 Day7 Days2 Weeks1 Month3 Months6 Months1 Year Oldest FirstNewest First         AirTalk.org Forum Index -> Sailplanes All times are GMT Page 1 of 1   Jump to: Select a forum Aviation----------------alt.aviationAviation safety EnhancementPlanes, gliders and flying in AustraliaAviation et pilotage (Français)rec.aviationAviation (Aerobatics)Hot air, gas balloons and airshipsHang-gliding, paragliding, foot-launched flightAircraft Design & BuildingInstrument Flight RulesAviation (Classifieds)Military AircraftNaval AviationAviation (Miscellaneous Topics)Owning AirplanesAviators (General Discussions)Aviation related productsAircraft RestorationHelicopters and rotary wing aircraftsFlight SimulationSailplanesAviation (Students)Light aircraftFlying related activities in the UK Airports----------------alt.airportsEdinburgh Airport Glasgow Airport Humberside Airport Luton Airport Aberdeen Airport Glasgow Prestwick Airport  You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2006 phpBB Group SEO toolkit © 2004-2006 webmedic.