AirTalk.org Aviation discussions newsgroups   Archives   FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Register   Profile   Log in to check your private messages   Log in  Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10  Next          AirTalk.org Forum Index -> Military Aircraft View previous topic :: View next topic   Author Message Paul Hirose Guest Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2003 10:32 pm    Post subject: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt The Edwards AFB air show on October 25 and 26 will feature attempts to set numerous world speed records with a B-1B. The speed runs will include low altitude passes over the show area. A release of 84 inert 500-lb bombs in view of the crowd will conclude the B-1 flying on both days. http://www.edwards.af.mil/oh_2003/docs_html/event-info.html -- Paul Hirose <ivxfp-x7gxj-0717 (AT) earthlink (DOT) net> Back to top Alan Minyard Guest Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 6:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt On Sat, 18 Oct 2003 22:32:00 GMT, Paul Hirose <ivxfp-x7gxj-0717 (AT) earthlink (DOT) net> wrote: Quote: The Edwards AFB air show on October 25 and 26 will feature attempts to set numerous world speed records with a B-1B. The speed runs will include low altitude passes over the show area. A release of 84 inert 500-lb bombs in view of the crowd will conclude the B-1 flying on both days. http://www.edwards.af.mil/oh_2003/docs_html/event-info.html How in the world is a B-1B going to set *any* speed records? Al Minyard Back to top Thomas Schoene Guest Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 6:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt "Alan Minyard" <aminyardis (AT) netdoor (DOT) com> wrote Quote: How in the world is a B-1B going to set *any* speed records? Not absolute records. It already has a bunch in its weight class for speed over particular courses, speed with certain payloads, etc. I expect the plan to improve on those and add some more. The B-1's current records are listed here, along with records by other aircraft in the same general categories. I imagine they'll be trying to take some away from the Tu-160. http://www.b1b.wpafb.af.mil/pages/pdf/b1_records.pdf --� Tom Schoene Replace "invalid" with "net" to e-mail "If brave men and women never died, there would be nothing special about bravery." -- Andy Rooney (attributed) Back to top Guy Alcala Guest Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 7:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt Alan Minyard wrote: Quote: On Sat, 18 Oct 2003 22:32:00 GMT, Paul Hirose [email]ivxfp-x7gxj-0717 (AT) earthlink (DOT) net[/email]> wrote: The Edwards AFB air show on October 25 and 26 will feature attempts to set numerous world speed records with a B-1B. The speed runs will include low altitude passes over the show area. A release of 84 inert 500-lb bombs in view of the crowd will conclude the B-1 flying on both days. http://www.edwards.af.mil/oh_2003/docs_html/event-info.html How in the world is a B-1B going to set *any* speed records? Probably the same way it set the numerous speed records it has held since 1987 and later; for closed circuits of 1,000km, 2,000km (both in class C-1q, 150,000 to 200,000 kg. t/o wgt.) and 5,000km (unlimited wgt. class) with payloads varying from zero to 30,000 kg., for 10,000km with zero payload (unlimited wgt.) , and for around the world eastbound (refueled in flight, unlimited wgt.). They might be looking to take a few more of the 10,000km records with payload from the B-52H which currently holds them, or else boost some of the 5,000km records or the around the world records they already hold. See http://records.fai.org/general_aviation/current.asp?id1=21&id2=4 for the current records. The other option, which sounds more like what they're talking about with the "speed runs," would be to try and set a low altitude speed record in its weight class; although AFAIK the FAI no longer recognizes low altitude speed records per se owing to the danger. Guy Back to top Paul Hirose Guest Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 11:52 pm    Post subject: Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt The local civilian newspaper has an article about the upcoming B-1 speed record attempts. The runs will be in two weight classes (on different days), each day including 100-, 500-, and 1000-km closed course runs, apparently at 500 feet. "The bomber will maintain speeds of 0.9 to 0.95 Mach, or nearly 700 mph, while skimming along at 500 feet above the ground." There will also be speed runs on 3- and 15-km straight line courses. The 3-km pass will be at 400 feet and .95 Mach. The 15-km pass will be at 15,000 and 1.2 Mach. Each day will conclude with the bomb load being dropped on the range about four miles from the air show grounds. http://www.avpress.com/n/susty1.hts -- Paul Hirose <ivxfp-x7gxj-0717 (AT) earthlink (DOT) net> Back to top BUFDRVR Guest Posted: Sun Oct 19, 2003 11:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt Quote: They might be looking to take a few more of the 10,000km records with payload from the B-52H which currently holds them Lots of luck, those records maxed out the B-52H unrefueled range, unless they've installed new engines in that Bone making it 50% more efficient I don't think they've got a chance. BUFDRVR "Stay on the bomb run boys, I'm gonna get those bomb doors open if it harelips everyone on Bear Creek" Back to top Scott Ferrin Guest Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2003 12:16 am    Post subject: Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt On Sun, 19 Oct 2003 18:56:42 GMT, "Thomas Schoene" <taschoene (AT) earthlink (DOT) invalid> wrote: Quote: "Alan Minyard" <aminyardis (AT) netdoor (DOT) com> wrote in message news:hjj5pv4kh4hat519uu7dnruvrmids573rd (AT) 4ax (DOT) com How in the world is a B-1B going to set *any* speed records? Not absolute records. It already has a bunch in its weight class for speed over particular courses, speed with certain payloads, etc. I expect the plan to improve on those and add some more. The B-1's current records are listed here, along with records by other aircraft in the same general categories. I imagine they'll be trying to take some away from the Tu-160. http://www.b1b.wpafb.af.mil/pages/pdf/b1_records.pdf I wish they'd get the fire to break more records these days like they did back in the fifties and sixties. Hell some of the "records" out there are ones that any line aircraft could break easily if not actually performing *beyond* them regularly. Back to top Regnirps Guest Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2003 7:18 am    Post subject: Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt Oh, crap! The table uses that French system with the km/hour I can never make sense of! -- Charlie Springer Back to top PosterBoy Guest Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2003 7:44 am    Post subject: Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt "Regnirps" <regnirps (AT) aol (DOT) com> wrote Quote: Oh, crap! The table uses that French system with the km/hour I can never make sense of! -- Charlie Springer I think you mean that nearly universal system with the km/hour. Try: http://www.teaching-english-in-japan.net/conversion/kilometers or, if you don't wish to learn anything, just want to convert: http://www.escapeartist.com/Miles_Kilometer_Converter/Miles_Kilometer_Converter.html Cheers. Back to top Guy Alcala Guest Posted: Mon Oct 20, 2003 10:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt BUFDRVR wrote: Quote: They might be looking to take a few more of the 10,000km records with payload from the B-52H which currently holds them Lots of luck, those records maxed out the B-52H unrefueled range, unless they've installed new engines in that Bone making it 50% more efficient I don't think they've got a chance. From Paul Hirose's post it appears that they aren't going for the 10,000 km records. Personally, I'd think that capturing the record for 10,000km at 1 and maybe 2,000 kg. payloads might be doable, given ideal conditions and very precise flying rather than any improvement in engine sfc. But maybe the 10,000km/no payload record was already on the edge of what could be physically achieved, and there's no room for improvement. Guy Back to top BUFDRVR Guest Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2003 12:15 am    Post subject: Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt Quote: Personally, I'd think that capturing the record for 10,000km at 1 and maybe 2,000 kg. payloads might be doable, given ideal conditions and very precise flying rather than any improvement in engine sfc. But maybe the 10,000km/no payload record was already on the edge of what could be physically achieved I think any 10,000 km distance is too far for the Bone if they push it up to break the BUFF record. I don't think they'll make it fuel wise. BUFDRVR "Stay on the bomb run boys, I'm gonna get those bomb doors open if it harelips everyone on Bear Creek" Back to top Regnirps Guest Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2003 4:26 am    Post subject: Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt "PosterBoy" [email]brauck (AT) bigfoot (DOT) STEPON2.com[/email] Wrote: Quote: "Regnirps" <regnirps (AT) aol (DOT) com> wrote in message Oh, crap! The table uses that French system with the km/hour I can never make sense of! -- Charlie Springer I think you mean that nearly universal system with the km/hour. Try: anip My 1952 Unabridged Dictionairy calls it "The French System" as it was for the previous 100 years, and as a physicist I find it convenient for mental calculations, but for every day hunam scale use it sucks. It was developed for scientific ellites. I'm sure you know that the units larger than one use Latin prefixes and those smaller use Greek, something easily noticed by a classically educated scientist of the 1880's. But for Mr. Goodwrench today? An 8 mm bolt in grade 8.8 comes in three standard thread pitches and you say "point seven oh" or "8mm with one point two five mm pitch" instead of "one quarter twenty four". Fooey. Have you ever tried to shout French measurements to someone in a noisy constructiuon environment? You can wind up with a doorway three inches high. It was officialy adopted by the US more than a hundred years ago. Do you think it hasn't caught on because people are stuborn or because it has usability problems (like similar sounding names for various units)? Would you try to make everybody drive cars they don't like for 150 years? A km is what, the distance from pole to equator divided by 15,000? What's a nautical mile? -- Charlie Springer Back to top PosterBoy Guest Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2003 6:48 am    Post subject: Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt "Regnirps" <regnirps (AT) aol (DOT) com> wrote Quote: "PosterBoy" [email]brauck (AT) bigfoot (DOT) STEPON2.com[/email] Wrote: "Regnirps" <regnirps (AT) aol (DOT) com> wrote in message Oh, crap! The table uses that French system with the km/hour I can never make sense of! -- Charlie Springer I think you mean that nearly universal system with the km/hour. Try: anip You have misquoted me. Please correct. Thanks, and.. Cheers. Back to top Greg Hennessy Guest Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2003 8:49 am    Post subject: Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt On 21 Oct 2003 04:26:44 GMT, [email]regnirps (AT) aol (DOT) com[/email] (Regnirps) wrote: Quote: Have you ever tried to shout French measurements to someone in a noisy constructiuon environment? Yes, and metric was the lingua franca of measurement when I last worked on building sites here in the UK 15-16 years ago. Quote: You can wind up with a doorway three inches high. One doesn't when the term of measurement is always expressed in millimetres, no decimal points, no fractions and a lot more convenient and accurate for general construction use than feet and inches, the nearest mil being approximately 1/25th of an inch. greg -- $ReplyAddress =~ s#@.*$##; # Delete everything after the '@' The Following is a true story..... Only the names have been changed to protect the guilty. Back to top Andreas Parsch Guest Posted: Tue Oct 21, 2003 10:27 am    Post subject: [OT] Units (Re: Edwards air show B-1 speed record attempt) Regnirps wrote: Quote: My 1952 Unabridged Dictionairy calls it "The French System" as it was for the previous 100 years, 1952 ... a great up-to-date source . Anyway, it's called "Système Internationale" or SI. So its _name_ is indeed French. Quote: and as a physicist I find it convenient for mental calculations, but for every day hunam scale use it sucks. No, it doesn't ... I've used it all my life. Quote: It was developed for scientific ellites. Not at all. It was developed to have a common system of measurement all over Europe at a time when almost every country (and sometimes village!) had its own pound, mile, etc. Quote: I'm sure you know that the units larger than one use Latin prefixes and those smaller use Greek, vice versa Quote: something easily noticed by a classically educated scientist of the 1880's. But for Mr. Goodwrench today? An 8 mm bolt in grade 8.8 comes in three standard thread pitches and you say "point seven oh" or "8mm with one point two five mm pitch" instead of "one quarter twenty four". Fooey. Have you ever tried to shout French measurements to someone in a noisy constructiuon environment? You can wind up with a doorway three inches high. Not any easier than with U.S. or Imperial units. BTW, a few years there was this unfortuante incident involving a multi-million $ NASA space probe and incompetent usage of U.S. units of distance ... Quote: It was officialy adopted by the US more than a hundred years ago. Do you think it hasn't caught on because people are stuborn Yes. People can be unbelievably stubborn when it comes to giving up old habits even if newer alternatives would be an improvement. Quote: or because it has usability problems (like similar sounding names for various units)? Huh?? "Meter" isn't any more similar to "gram" than, say, "foot" is to "ounce". If you refer to the common prefixes, this is the big _advantage_. If you know that a kilometer is 1000 meters, you immediately know that a kilogram is 1000 grams, a kilovolt is 1000 volts, etc. No need to memorize all the factors to convert inches -> feet -> miles, ounces -> pounds, and whatever. Quote: Would you try to make everybody drive cars they don't like for 150 years? A km is what, the distance from pole to equator divided by 15,000? Roughly the circumference of the earth divided by 40,000. I don't know the origin of the (statute) mile, but I'm sure you'll tell me that its defintion is _way_ more intuitive . Quote: What's a nautical mile? 1852 meters . Andreas Back to top Display posts from previous: All Posts1 Day7 Days2 Weeks1 Month3 Months6 Months1 Year Oldest FirstNewest First         AirTalk.org Forum Index -> Military Aircraft All times are GMT Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10  Next Page 1 of 10   Jump to: Select a forum Aviation----------------alt.aviationAviation safety EnhancementPlanes, gliders and flying in AustraliaAviation et pilotage (Français)rec.aviationAviation (Aerobatics)Hot air, gas balloons and airshipsHang-gliding, paragliding, foot-launched flightAircraft Design & BuildingInstrument Flight RulesAviation (Classifieds)Military AircraftNaval AviationAviation (Miscellaneous Topics)Owning AirplanesAviators (General Discussions)Aviation related productsAircraft RestorationHelicopters and rotary wing aircraftsFlight SimulationSailplanesAviation (Students)Light aircraftFlying related activities in the UK Airports----------------alt.airportsEdinburgh Airport Glasgow Airport Humberside Airport Luton Airport Aberdeen Airport Glasgow Prestwick Airport  You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2006 phpBB Group SEO toolkit © 2004-2006 webmedic.