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cab
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 Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2003 2:01 pm Post subject: e6b2 junk? |
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just finished ground school. While taking the final, the whole wheel
assembly on the winds side fell out! glue is undone, wheel keeps
falling out, and the grid is getting scratched off. I've only used
the thing about 3 times. Are these things junk?
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Sydney Hoeltzli
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| Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2003 2:12 pm Post subject: Re: e6b2 junk? |
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cab wrote:
| Quote: | just finished ground school. While taking the final, the whole wheel
assembly on the winds side fell out! glue is undone, wheel keeps
falling out, and the grid is getting scratched off. I've only used
the thing about 3 times. Are these things junk?
|
What kind do you have? We have an ASA aluminum E6B which has been
slammed around literally and figuratively for close to 10 yrs,
saw yoeman duty through 2 PPLs, and is still going strong.
We have a cardboard Jepp "flight computer" (just like E6B)
which gets used less often, but it's still strong. It went
through all the flight planning for an IR and still gets used.
So they're not all junk -- no promises on your specific item
though.
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Kiwi Jet Jock
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2003 12:35 am Post subject: Re: e6b2 junk? |
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I'll go first,
Yep - probably the last time you'll need to do a pre-flight too - or file a
flight plan - or check the forecast - or check the fuel
"Tim Bengtson" <timbeng (AT) us (DOT) nospam.ibm.wellmaybe.com> wrote
| Quote: | cab wrote:
just finished ground school. While taking the final, the whole wheel
assembly on the winds side fell out! glue is undone, wheel keeps
falling out, and the grid is getting scratched off. I've only used
the thing about 3 times. Are these things junk?
As long as it got you through your test, you're golden. That's the last
time you would have used the thing anyway.
Yes, here come a bunch of posts from people who still use their E6B. Go
figure.
Tim
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lardsoup
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2003 11:53 am Post subject: Re: e6b2 junk? |
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That's the mini e6b right? Mine had the same problems. Sent ot back to ASA
and they replaced it.
"cab" <acdc (AT) nc (DOT) rr.com> wrote
| Quote: | just finished ground school. While taking the final, the whole wheel
assembly on the winds side fell out! glue is undone, wheel keeps
falling out, and the grid is getting scratched off. I've only used
the thing about 3 times. Are these things junk?
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Dylan Smith
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2003 12:18 pm Post subject: Re: e6b2 junk? |
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On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 12:35:42 +1200, Kiwi Jet Jock <spam (AT) nospam (DOT) com> wrote:
| Quote: | I'll go first,
Yep - probably the last time you'll need to do a pre-flight too - or file a
flight plan - or check the forecast - or check the fuel
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Cute, but you're wrong.
An experienced GA pilot will be even more insistent to check the
forecast, check for fuel, or file an IFR flight plan [0] on the ground
rather than waiting till the weather goes to poop and get a pop-up
clearance.
But as for the functions offered by an E6B? An experienced GA pilot
can usually do just as well by estimating, or at the worst, using
a normal pocket calculator. Time and distance and wind drift are
trivial to estimate accurately in your head. So is fuel burn. You
don't need millilitre or to the second accuracy when on a VFR cross
country. Someone who's learned estimation, instead of trusting a
device (mechanical or electrical) will have a far better sense for
rejecting junk answers generated by bad i nput.
[0] For VFR flight plans, I'd rather file a "friends and family" flight
plan, i.e. call who you're seeing before you set off, and give them
an ETA. I bet it'd get search and rescue out far quicker than filing one
with the authorities.
--
Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net
"Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee"
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journeyman
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2003 1:49 pm Post subject: Re: e6b2 junk? |
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On Wed, 23 Jul 2003 12:35:42 +1200, Kiwi Jet Jock <spam (AT) nospam (DOT) com> wrote:
| Quote: | Yes, here come a bunch of posts from people who still use their E6B. Go
figure.
I'll go first,
Yep - probably the last time you'll need to do a pre-flight too - or file a
flight plan - or check the forecast - or check the fuel
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In all fairness, I'm pretty amazed at how accurately one can eyeball
a flight of, say, 2 hours or less. For longer flights, you may want
to use something electronic for convenience.
And I'm a firm believer in learning the fundamentals first. Besides,
I think the whole circular slide rule thing is just too cool.
Morris (who still keeps his E6B handy in the flight bag)
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Sydney Hoeltzli
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2003 1:57 pm Post subject: Re: e6b2 junk? |
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Dylan Smith wrote:
| Quote: | But as for the functions offered by an E6B? An experienced GA pilot
can usually do just as well by estimating, or at the worst, using
a normal pocket calculator.
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I dunno, Dylan. I still use our E6B to quickly compare ground
speeds at different altitudes, sum them to time&distance to climb,
and determine optimal altitude.
We have CoPilot, and I'm pretty good at using trig estimates
to do the math in my head, but I still haven't found anything
which lets me determine the optimum altitude so painlessly and
quickly. Plus I find it easier to use the E6B in-flight to
determine winds aloft etc for Pireps, than poking around at
a little Palm screen with a stylus.
YMMV and evidently does.
| Quote: | [0] For VFR flight plans, I'd rather file a "friends and family" flight
plan, i.e. call who you're seeing before you set off, and give them
an ETA. I bet it'd get search and rescue out far quicker than filing one
with the authorities.
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I think this is going to depend entirely upon the persistance of
your "friends and family" and how good they are at dealing with
authority. Remember that JFK, Jr. had people waiting for him, and
lacking a flight plan or sufficiently specific knowledge about who
to call and what to say, they basically wound up going home. Not
that it would have mattered in his case as it turns out, but one
can easily envision slightly different circs where it could have
been critical. So be sure your friends and family know just who to
call, what to say, and have the tenacity of pit bulls and the ability
to keep their cool when dealing with bureaucrats. (this actually
describes my mother to a "T". She once tracked me down at a friend's
house, armed with only a first name, a city of residence, and the
information that the person in question used to work at a scout
camp in New York State. She's good, and sufficiently deaf that
she never takes no for an answer, not being able to hear it *g*)
Personally, I don't see the harm in using both. And of course,
convenient friends and family are not always available everywhere
you fly or at every arrival time. At least for me, maybe your
friends and family are more numerous or more consistantly reachable
by phone and at your service.
Cheers,
Sydney
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Roger Halstead
Guest
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| Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2003 9:54 pm Post subject: Re: e6b2 junk? |
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On Tue, 22 Jul 2003 08:01:45 -0700, Tim Bengtson
<timbeng (AT) us (DOT) nospam.ibm.wellmaybe.com> wrote:
| Quote: | cab wrote:
just finished ground school. While taking the final, the whole wheel
assembly on the winds side fell out! glue is undone, wheel keeps
falling out, and the grid is getting scratched off. I've only used
the thing about 3 times. Are these things junk?
As long as it got you through your test, you're golden. That's the last
time you would have used the thing anyway.
Yes, here come a bunch of posts from people who still use their E6B. Go
figure.
|
Not from me.
I have a *big* e6b and a small e6b and I have two different models of
the electronic e6b....I do keep the little mechanical one in my flight
bag, but I've never needed to use it.
I do carry a simple calculator which I have used on occasion to figure
the distance to the approach before I must be on my way down. Usually
I can figure that in my head as well.
Between the VORs, RNAV, and GPS I have an up-to-date picture of the
winds and where I am. After flying the Deb for over a 1000 hours, my
intuitive location is usually within a few miles of the navigation
equipment.
I have not used an e6b of any form for flight planning since receiving
my PPL. I just haven't found it necessary. Typically the winds
aloft vary enough from the e6b figures that my "best guess" is as
close, while the in flight figures are right on...although they may
change often.
HOWEVER... I flew a 172 for a few weeks while the Deb was down for
maintenance. My intuitive flight planner was really thrown out of
kilter...It was a case of the 200 MPH mind in the 120 MPH airplane.
Course that's a whole lot better than the 120 MPH mind in a 200 MPH
airplane.
Roger Halstead (K8RI EN73 & ARRL Life Member)
www.rogerhalstead.com
N833R World's oldest Debonair? (S# CD-2)
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cab
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2003 12:47 am Post subject: Re: e6b2 junk? |
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mine is APR, Aero Products Research. It sure has fallen apart quickly.
Sydney Hoeltzli <last_name (AT) swbell (DOT) net> wrote in news:3F1D456F.7050907
@swbell.net:
| Quote: | cab wrote:
just finished ground school. While taking the final, the whole wheel
assembly on the winds side fell out! glue is undone, wheel keeps
falling out, and the grid is getting scratched off. I've only used
the thing about 3 times. Are these things junk?
What kind do you have? We have an ASA aluminum E6B which has been
slammed around literally and figuratively for close to 10 yrs,
saw yoeman duty through 2 PPLs, and is still going strong.
We have a cardboard Jepp "flight computer" (just like E6B)
which gets used less often, but it's still strong. It went
through all the flight planning for an IR and still gets used.
So they're not all junk -- no promises on your specific item
though.
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Greg Burkhart
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2003 1:48 am Post subject: Re: e6b2 junk? |
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I haven't seen the APR Industries flight computers except for the keychain
version. I have a mini ASA E6B in my logbook case and keep a full size Kane
in the plane. I also have the APR keychain and haven't had any problems with
any of them...
Have you tried contacting APR for repair or replacement? I found this
address:
APR Industries
11201 Hindry Ave.
LA, CA 90045-6299
For the cost of replace/repair and shipping, you may be better off getting a
Kane, Jepp or ASA model from EBay or similar...
"cab" <acdc (AT) nc (DOT) rr.com> wrote
| Quote: | mine is APR, Aero Products Research. It sure has fallen apart quickly.
Sydney Hoeltzli <last_name (AT) swbell (DOT) net> wrote in news:3F1D456F.7050907
@swbell.net:
cab wrote:
just finished ground school. While taking the final, the whole wheel
assembly on the winds side fell out! glue is undone, wheel keeps
falling out, and the grid is getting scratched off. I've only used
the thing about 3 times. Are these things junk?
What kind do you have? We have an ASA aluminum E6B which has been
slammed around literally and figuratively for close to 10 yrs,
saw yoeman duty through 2 PPLs, and is still going strong.
We have a cardboard Jepp "flight computer" (just like E6B)
which gets used less often, but it's still strong. It went
through all the flight planning for an IR and still gets used.
So they're not all junk -- no promises on your specific item
though.
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Kiwi Jet Jock
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2003 9:18 am Post subject: Re: e6b2 junk? |
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| Quote: | Cute, but you're wrong.
An experienced GA pilot will be even more insistent to check the
forecast, check for fuel, or file an IFR flight plan [0] on the ground
rather than waiting till the weather goes to poop and get a pop-up
clearance.
|
You could be right - I've only been doing this close to 50 years with around
24,000 hours, so still learning :)
What I like about any slide rule is that once you've set a particular ratio
(eg groundspeed) you can then quickly read off as many (eg) time/distance
calculations as you like - beats the pants off a calculator for this kind of
thing.
I was really just commenting on (what I perceived to be) a bit of a
complacent attitude creeping in.
I also collect slide rules, so I might be a little biased!
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