AirTalk.org Aviation discussions newsgroups   Archives   FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Register   Profile   Log in to check your private messages   Log in  Cost of operating a Skyhawk Goto page 1, 2  Next          AirTalk.org Forum Index -> Owning Airplanes View previous topic :: View next topic   Author Message vincent p. norris Guest Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2004 3:45 am    Post subject: Cost of operating a Skyhawk Can anyone who owns a Cessna 172 tell me approximately what it costs per hour to operate--fuel, oil, normal maintenance, engine overhaul fund? Thanks. vince norris Back to top Steven Barnes Guest Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2004 4:07 am    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk "vincent p. norris" <vpn1 (AT) psu (DOT) edu> wrote Quote: Can anyone who owns a Cessna 172 tell me approximately what it costs per hour to operate--fuel, oil, normal maintenance, engine overhaul fund? Thanks. vince norris Slightly more money than you have... ;-) Back to top tony roberts Guest Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2004 4:29 am    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk Not possible without knowing how many hours per year you will fly Tony -- [email]Indiacharlieecho (AT) hotmail (DOT) com[/email] Tony Roberts PP-ASEL VFR OTT Night Cessna 172H C-GICE In article <mbnkk09e73dvie4ftcnn58noaffm6q2efm (AT) 4ax (DOT) com>, vincent p. norris <vpn1 (AT) psu (DOT) edu> wrote: Quote: Can anyone who owns a Cessna 172 tell me approximately what it costs per hour to operate--fuel, oil, normal maintenance, engine overhaul fund? Thanks. vince norris Back to top e.drucker.remove@verizon. Guest Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2004 4:48 am    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk On 16-Sep-2004, vincent p. norris <vpn1 (AT) psu (DOT) edu> wrote: Quote: Can anyone who owns a Cessna 172 tell me approximately what it costs per hour to operate--fuel, oil, normal maintenance, engine overhaul fund? It depends primarily on number of hours flown per year, but given that value it's not too tough to calculate. DIRECT OPERATING COST: Figure 8 gal fuel/hr @ $3.00/gal = $24/hr Figure $16000 for engine overhaul, 2000 hr TBO = $8/hr Figure usage related maintenance = maybe $2/hr (assuming you do your own oil changes) TOTAL DIRECT OPERATNG COSTS = $34/hr FIXED COSTS: Tiedown/hangar, could be anywhere from free to $500/mo. Lets say tiedown at $100/mo = $1200/yr Insurance will depend upon pilot experience and hull value. Let's say $800/yr Annual inspection and other maintenance: When we had a 172 I think it averaged around $1600/yr. (including avionics). TOTAL FIXED COSTS = $3600/yr If the plane is flown a typical 150 hrs/yr, fixed costs as estimated above come in at $24/hr, so total operating cost per hour would be $34 + $24 = $58. But if you only fly 50 hrs/yr the hourly cost is a whopping $96. Note that this analysis does not include depreciation (or appreciation) or costs for periodic painting and interior upgrades, or interest charges on a loan, if applicable. YMMV. -- -Elliott Drucker Back to top Dan Truesdell Guest Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2004 6:29 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk We have a 5-way partnership in a IFR '64 172 based at CNH. We split $300/mo for fixed cost. Breakdown: $120/mo hanger (cheap hanger rent here) $125/mo for insurance (4th and 5th partner really increases the premiums) $700/yr for annual We charge $35 for operating costs. (Gas at CNH is $2.51 right now.) Gives us about $20 for gas, $10 for engine reserve on a new 180HP O360, and $5 for maintenance. This always brings us up short, as annuals usually are between $2000 and $3000. vincent p. norris wrote: Quote: Can anyone who owns a Cessna 172 tell me approximately what it costs per hour to operate--fuel, oil, normal maintenance, engine overhaul fund? Thanks. vince norris -- Remove "2PLANES" to reply. Back to top Tony Roberts Guest Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2004 10:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk Quote: It's perfectly possible. The only one of the variables he listed that changes with the total number of hours flown will be normal maintenence. You can figure about 8 gph. You'll need blah blah blah It is not possible. If an average annual costs $2000, if you fly 1 hour per year, you will need to allow $2000 per hour toward annual. If you fly 2000 hours per year you will be allowing $1.00 per hour toward annual. The same thing applies to several other costs . Tony C-GICE Back to top vincent p. norris Guest Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2004 1:30 am    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk Thanks to all who went to the trouble of writing thoughtful replies. I tried to be brief, so I didn't explain that I'm not planning to buy a Skyhawk ( perhaps I should have). I'll be touring the Canadian Maritimes with a friend in his Skyhawk, and I want to pay half of the operating (not fixed) costs. He said he had no idea what his hourly cost is, but you guys gave me a pretty good range of estimates. vince norris Back to top jay somerset Guest Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2004 1:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 21:30:53 -0400, vincent p. norris <vpn1 (AT) psu (DOT) edu> wrote: Quote: Thanks to all who went to the trouble of writing thoughtful replies. I tried to be brief, so I didn't explain that I'm not planning to buy a Skyhawk ( perhaps I should have). I'll be touring the Canadian Maritimes with a friend in his Skyhawk, and I want to pay half of the operating (not fixed) costs. He said he had no idea what his hourly cost is, but you guys gave me a pretty good range of estimates. vince norris I am really surprised that an aircraft owner/pilot does not how much his operating costs are. That is just about fundamental for an owner/pilot. Back to top G.R. Patterson III Guest Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2004 5:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk jay somerset wrote: Quote: I am really surprised that an aircraft owner/pilot does not how much his operating costs are. Why? I don't know what mine are. I don't want to know. If I were in business with the plane, it would be a different matter. George Patterson If a man gets into a fight 3,000 miles away from home, he *had* to have been looking for it. Back to top vincent p. norris Guest Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 2:44 am    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk Quote: I am really surprised that an aircraft owner/pilot does not how much his operating costs are. That is just about fundamental for an owner/pilot. Well, before I posted that request, I had asked several Cessna owners I know, and not one of them could tell me what it cost. We knew what our Warrior cost because there were four of us and we had to know what to charge ourselves. vince norris Back to top Newps Guest Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:09 am    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk jay somerset wrote: Quote: On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 21:30:53 -0400, vincent p. norris wrote: Thanks to all who went to the trouble of writing thoughtful replies. I tried to be brief, so I didn't explain that I'm not planning to buy a Skyhawk ( perhaps I should have). I'll be touring the Canadian Maritimes with a friend in his Skyhawk, and I want to pay half of the operating (not fixed) costs. He said he had no idea what his hourly cost is, but you guys gave me a pretty good range of estimates. vince norris I am really surprised that an aircraft owner/pilot does not how much his operating costs are. That is just about fundamental for an owner/pilot. To what degree of accuracy? I know the total dollars I will spend per year to within a thousand or two. But I have no idea what it costs per hour. That's not even an important number. Back to top Jim Carter Guest Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk "vincent p. norris" <vpn1 (AT) psu (DOT) edu> wrote Quote: ... I'll be touring the Canadian Maritimes with a friend in his Skyhawk, and I want to pay half of the operating (not fixed) costs. ... vince norris Why shouldn't you pay for half the total costs? If your friend hadn't invested in the aircraft then you would have to rent one. The rental will include half the total costs plus some markup for the owner. How is it fair that you should only pay for fuel direct cost? Back to top Jim Carter Guest Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk -- Jim Carter "Jim Carter" <jimcarte (AT) swbell (DOT) net> wrote Quote: "vincent p. norris" <vpn1 (AT) psu (DOT) edu> wrote in message news:kk3nk0h5buamdail2dednbmmvvpqmqngsd (AT) 4ax (DOT) com... ... I'll be touring the Canadian Maritimes with a friend in his Skyhawk, and I want to pay half of the operating (not fixed) costs. ... vince norris Why shouldn't you pay for half the total costs? If your friend hadn't invested in the aircraft then you would have to rent one. The rental will include half the total costs plus some markup for the owner. How is it fair that you should only pay for fuel direct cost? That last sentence should read "How is it fair that you should only pay for direct (variable) costs?" Back to top jimp@specsol-spam-sux.com Guest Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 3:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk Jim Carter <jimcarte (AT) swbell (DOT) net> wrote: Quote: "vincent p. norris" <vpn1 (AT) psu (DOT) edu> wrote in message news:kk3nk0h5buamdail2dednbmmvvpqmqngsd (AT) 4ax (DOT) com... ... I'll be touring the Canadian Maritimes with a friend in his Skyhawk, and I want to pay half of the operating (not fixed) costs. ... vince norris Why shouldn't you pay for half the total costs? If your friend hadn't invested in the aircraft then you would have to rent one. The rental will include half the total costs plus some markup for the owner. How is it fair that you should only pay for fuel direct cost? If the friend is a US pilot, there are the restrictions of 14 CFR 61.113 about reimbursement. If you want to concider it a rental, then all the requirements like 100hr inspections apply. In any case, if I were to share an auto trip with someone, I wouldn't expect them to pay a share of my annual insurance or prorated cost of new tires. -- Jim Pennino Remove -spam-sux to reply. Back to top Jim Carter Guest Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2004 4:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Cost of operating a Skyhawk <jimp (AT) specsol-spam-sux (DOT) com> wrote Quote: Jim Carter <jimcarte (AT) swbell (DOT) net> wrote: ... If the friend is a US pilot, there are the restrictions of 14 CFR 61.113 about reimbursement. The restrictions prohibit the pilot (friend) from making a profit, they do not restrict the owner from recovering a pro-rata percentage of the operating cost of the aircraft. I believe the total costs would be considered operating costs because if the owner didn't invest in the aircraft to start with how could it be operated at all? Quote: If you want to concider it a rental, then all the requirements like 100hr inspections apply. Right. That's part of my point when I mentioned renting costing more than just direct costs, however I suppose a 100 hour would be an additional direct cost with which the private owner wouldn't have to deal. Quote: In any case, if I were to share an auto trip with someone, I wouldn't expect them to pay a share of my annual insurance or prorated cost of new tires. -- Jim Pennino Why not Jim? How is it fair that the owner pay for items from which the passenger benefits? I have to admit that I don't charge passengers to ride with me in the car as long as I have to go anyway, but that's my choice. The fair thing is to split all costs evenly and that should be assumed by any passenger in any vehicle. If the owner/operator wants to be more gratious then that's their choice, not the passengers. Mr. Norris was the passenger on this trip, and it was he who had written that he wouldn't pay anything except direct costs. I think that is the morally wrong position for him to take. 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