AirTalk.org Aviation discussions newsgroups   Archives   FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Register   Profile   Log in to check your private messages   Log in  Aerobatics before PPL??          AirTalk.org Forum Index -> Planes, gliders and flying in Australia View previous topic :: View next topic   Author Message edcook24 Guest Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 6:32 am    Post subject: Aerobatics before PPL?? I'm up to Navex 3 (8 months ago)at RVAC, Moorabbin and I've run low on cash. I'm toying with the idea of gaining an Aerobatics rating to improve my flying skills (and keep costs down) rather than continue with the Navs as I can only afford one every two months, what are peoples views on this idea? -- edcook24 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Posted via OziPilots Online [ http://www.OziPilotsOnline.com.au ] - A website for Australian Pilots regardless of when, why, or what they fly - Back to top Mozart Guest Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 7:21 am    Post subject: Re: Aerobatics before PPL?? Quote: "edcook24" wrote: I'm up to Navex 3 (8 months ago)at RVAC, Moorabbin and I've run low on cash. I'm toying with the idea of gaining an Aerobatics rating to improve my flying skills (and keep costs down) rather than continue with the Navs as I can only afford one every two months, what are peoples views on this idea? Hello. One NAVEX every two months means that the beginning of each exercise is spent revising all your previous sequences, so it's unlikely you're performing as well as you would if you were flying, say, once a week. I wouldn't recommend conducting your training like this. Nav training only consists of a short number of navs which, ideally, should be flown within a three-week block to ensure you get the most out of them. Continuity of training is really important for ALL your elementary training because there is simply so much to learn (and forget). Sure, you can leave flights two months apart, or even 6 months apart, but it's likely to cost you more in flying time (and knowledge) long-term. I think you answered your own question. If you're flying irregularly aerobatics is a fantastic option. It will improve your flying skills to no end, it will cost you less and will keep your flying current so when you do cash up for nav training, the last thing that will hold you back is basic handling skills. Have a talk to your CFI or instructor. Good luck. Back to top Bernie Samms Guest Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:25 am    Post subject: Re: Aerobatics before PPL?? Agree in spades. Its not easy to build your nav skills every 8 weeks or so. Have a bit of fun and save!!! Then you can get that PPL much easier and probably not that much slower. -- Bernie Samms Kingston Beach Tasmania Aero Club of Southern Tasmania www.acst.com.au Prologic Pty Ltd www.prologic.com.au Out Mail has been checked by Norton Anti Virus but no absolute guarantee is made that mail or attachment(s) are virus free. "Mozart" <nil> wrote Quote: "edcook24" wrote: I'm up to Navex 3 (8 months ago)at RVAC, Moorabbin and I've run low on cash. I'm toying with the idea of gaining an Aerobatics rating to improve my flying skills (and keep costs down) rather than continue with the Navs as I can only afford one every two months, what are peoples views on this idea? Hello. One NAVEX every two months means that the beginning of each exercise is spent revising all your previous sequences, so it's unlikely you're performing as well as you would if you were flying, say, once a week. I wouldn't recommend conducting your training like this. Nav training only consists of a short number of navs which, ideally, should be flown within a three-week block to ensure you get the most out of them. Continuity of training is really important for ALL your elementary training because there is simply so much to learn (and forget). Sure, you can leave flights two months apart, or even 6 months apart, but it's likely to cost you more in flying time (and knowledge) long-term. I think you answered your own question. If you're flying irregularly aerobatics is a fantastic option. It will improve your flying skills to no end, it will cost you less and will keep your flying current so when you do cash up for nav training, the last thing that will hold you back is basic handling skills. Have a talk to your CFI or instructor. Good luck. Back to top Stealth Pilot Guest Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 9:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Aerobatics before PPL?? On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 18:21:48 +1100, "Mozart" <nil> wrote: Quote: "edcook24" wrote: I'm up to Navex 3 (8 months ago)at RVAC, Moorabbin and I've run low on cash. I'm toying with the idea of gaining an Aerobatics rating to improve my flying skills (and keep costs down) rather than continue with the Navs as I can only afford one every two months, what are peoples views on this idea? Hello. One NAVEX every two months means that the beginning of each exercise is spent revising all your previous sequences, so it's unlikely you're performing as well as you would if you were flying, say, once a week. I wouldn't recommend conducting your training like this. Nav training only consists of a short number of navs which, ideally, should be flown within a three-week block to ensure you get the most out of them. Continuity of training is really important for ALL your elementary training because there is simply so much to learn (and forget). Sure, you can leave flights two months apart, or even 6 months apart, but it's likely to cost you more in flying time (and knowledge) long-term. I think you answered your own question. If you're flying irregularly aerobatics is a fantastic option. It will improve your flying skills to no end, it will cost you less and will keep your flying current so when you do cash up for nav training, the last thing that will hold you back is basic handling skills. Have a talk to your CFI or instructor. Good luck. no wonder young guys end up with no pilots licence after spending thousands on flight training. my son has over 120 hours and no licence (yet) because he followed this stupid advice. focus on the target. the target is to get your qualifications and experience consolidated into a perpetually valid licence. you have a gfpt so you can fly in the training area to keep up the skills. just do a half hour flight in the circuit every fortnight and save up for the navs. being sucked into an aerobatics endorsement is something that the aeroclubs seem to use as a national strategy. keep the kid unqualified and he will have to come back to us to fly. must be worth thousands a pilot to the scum suckers. (apologies unintended) FOCUS ON COMPLETING YOUR NAVS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you only have Stealth Pilot Back to top lozza Guest Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Aerobatics before PPL?? Stealth Pilot wrote: Quote: On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 18:21:48 +1100, "Mozart" <nil> wrote: "edcook24" wrote: I'm up to Navex 3 (8 months ago)at RVAC, Moorabbin and I've run low on cash. I'm toying with the idea of gaining an Aerobatics rating to improve my flying skills (and keep costs down) rather than continue with the Navs as I can only afford one every two months, what are peoples views on this idea? Hello. One NAVEX every two months means that the beginning of each exercise is spent revising all your previous sequences, so it's unlikely you're performing as well as you would if you were flying, say, once a week. I wouldn't recommend conducting your training like this. Nav training only consists of a short number of navs which, ideally, should be flown within a three-week block to ensure you get the most out of them. Continuity of training is really important for ALL your elementary training because there is simply so much to learn (and forget). Sure, you can leave flights two months apart, or even 6 months apart, but it's likely to cost you more in flying time (and knowledge) long-term. I think you answered your own question. If you're flying irregularly aerobatics is a fantastic option. It will improve your flying skills to no end, it will cost you less and will keep your flying current so when you do cash up for nav training, the last thing that will hold you back is basic handling skills. Have a talk to your CFI or instructor. Good luck. no wonder young guys end up with no pilots licence after spending thousands on flight training. my son has over 120 hours and no licence (yet) because he followed this stupid advice. focus on the target. the target is to get your qualifications and experience consolidated into a perpetually valid licence. you have a gfpt so you can fly in the training area to keep up the skills. just do a half hour flight in the circuit every fortnight and save up for the navs. being sucked into an aerobatics endorsement is something that the aeroclubs seem to use as a national strategy. keep the kid unqualified and he will have to come back to us to fly. must be worth thousands a pilot to the scum suckers. (apologies unintended) FOCUS ON COMPLETING YOUR NAVS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you only have Stealth Pilot I agree with all the above,especially with training area flights, currency saves cash in handfulls.Due to work & financial commitments I have postponed my navs untill I can do them all in one block of time.However I did complete an emergency manoeuvre training course with action aerobatics which taught me more about what makes a plane fly than all the books and hours to gfpt put together.A well spent 1500 odd dollars in my book. Laurie Back to top GO BLUZ Guest Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 11:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Aerobatics before PPL?? Dont you need a PPL before you can do any endorsements? "lozza" <laurie.dempsey (AT) hunterlink (DOT) net.au> wrote Quote: Stealth Pilot wrote: On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 18:21:48 +1100, "Mozart" <nil> wrote: "edcook24" wrote: I'm up to Navex 3 (8 months ago)at RVAC, Moorabbin and I've run low on cash. I'm toying with the idea of gaining an Aerobatics rating to improve my flying skills (and keep costs down) rather than continue with the Navs as I can only afford one every two months, what are peoples views on this idea? Hello. One NAVEX every two months means that the beginning of each exercise is spent revising all your previous sequences, so it's unlikely you're performing as well as you would if you were flying, say, once a week. I wouldn't recommend conducting your training like this. Nav training only consists of a short number of navs which, ideally, should be flown within a three-week block to ensure you get the most out of them. Continuity of training is really important for ALL your elementary training because there is simply so much to learn (and forget). Sure, you can leave flights two months apart, or even 6 months apart, but it's likely to cost you more in flying time (and knowledge) long-term. I think you answered your own question. If you're flying irregularly aerobatics is a fantastic option. It will improve your flying skills to no end, it will cost you less and will keep your flying current so when you do cash up for nav training, the last thing that will hold you back is basic handling skills. Have a talk to your CFI or instructor. Good luck. no wonder young guys end up with no pilots licence after spending thousands on flight training. my son has over 120 hours and no licence (yet) because he followed this stupid advice. focus on the target. the target is to get your qualifications and experience consolidated into a perpetually valid licence. you have a gfpt so you can fly in the training area to keep up the skills. just do a half hour flight in the circuit every fortnight and save up for the navs. being sucked into an aerobatics endorsement is something that the aeroclubs seem to use as a national strategy. keep the kid unqualified and he will have to come back to us to fly. must be worth thousands a pilot to the scum suckers. (apologies unintended) FOCUS ON COMPLETING YOUR NAVS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you only have Stealth Pilot I agree with all the above,especially with training area flights, currency saves cash in handfulls.Due to work & financial commitments I have postponed my navs untill I can do them all in one block of time.However I did complete an emergency manoeuvre training course with action aerobatics which taught me more about what makes a plane fly than all the books and hours to gfpt put together.A well spent 1500 odd dollars in my book. Laurie Back to top Mozart Guest Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 11:35 pm    Post subject: Re: Aerobatics before PPL?? Quote: "GO BLUZ" wrote: Dont you need a PPL before you can do any endorsements? Aerobatics isn't an 'endorsement'. It's simply a log book authorisation to permit certain manouvers. Refer: Para. 2.4 http://www.casa.gov.au/download/orders/cao40/4000.pdf Back to top Mozart Guest Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2005 11:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Aerobatics before PPL?? Quote: Aerobatics isn't an 'endorsement'. It's simply a log book authorisation to permit certain manouvers. Refer: Para. 2.4 http://www.casa.gov.au/download/orders/cao40/4000.pdf DO'H. My apologies for spelling of "manoeuvres". Can't believe I did that... Back to top paulsims Guest Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 1:02 am    Post subject: Re: Aerobatics before PPL?? I agree with the guys above, do short flights every couple of weeks to stay current and save up for your full PPL. I also trained at Moorabbin, but founs I ended up with stacks of hours logged but no PPL. So I saved up the cash, then spent 10 days away on holiday where I flew with the Wangarrata Aero Club every day doing navs, and within 2 weeks had my PPL. Greg the CFI at Wangarrata is great to fly with, and I learnt more about flying with him than in 100 hours of previous flying at YMMB. We flow in both good and marginal weather so you soon learn limits and increase your judgement on when and where to fly. Good luck with your flying, but this was a great way to learn. Cheers Paul. -- paulsims ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Posted via OziPilots Online [ http://www.OziPilotsOnline.com.au ] - A website for Australian Pilots regardless of when, why, or what they fly - Back to top Peter Tebbutt Guest Posted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 7:50 am    Post subject: Re: Aerobatics before PPL?? Quote: as I can only afford one every two months, what are peoples views on this idea? Don't I know how you feel! I bought a farm back when I did my restricted ppl, and didn't finish the navs.... A dozen years later, I've saved up enough to stop the bank manager writing those dirty letters,and I'm back flying finally, with an old ultralight instructor that has done all sorts of bush flying. He's teaching me all sorts of cool flying skills that are improving my flying much more than just doing a few navs. Have a look at his daughter's website which gives a run down on both her father, and her man as well. http://www.aeros.com.au/ I'll be doing a few lessons in how to fly upside down with Mal later, who will also be finalising my ppl and signing off the navs. But for now, the level of skill I am gaining in handling an aircraft on the ground and very close to the ground, and love having an experienced pilot teaching me so much more than I had ever even dreamed about. The difference between a light aircraft on a bush strip with NO inertia, and driving a C172 bus on the freeway is teaching me how to handle the beast and the air! Go out and find the crankiest old bugger you can, and get him to teach you to fly! Hope this helps, Peter Back to top KMH Guest Posted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 10:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Aerobatics before PPL?? Definitely Ed! I think basic aeros should be an integral part of flight training. Your flying skills will improve immensely and you'll stay current until you can afford to finish your navs. Mal "edcook24" <edcook24 (AT) REMOVETHISOziPilotsOnline (DOT) com.au> wrote Quote: I'm up to Navex 3 (8 months ago)at RVAC, Moorabbin and I've run low on cash. I'm toying with the idea of gaining an Aerobatics rating to improve my flying skills (and keep costs down) rather than continue with the Navs as I can only afford one every two months, what are peoples views on this idea? -- edcook24 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Posted via OziPilots Online [ http://www.OziPilotsOnline.com.au ] - A website for Australian Pilots regardless of when, why, or what they fly - Back to top edcook24 Guest Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 5:13 am    Post subject: Re: Aerobatics before PPL?? Thanks to everyone who has responded with such valuable advice, very useful. -- edcook24 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Posted via OziPilots Online [ http://www.OziPilotsOnline.com.au ] - A website for Australian Pilots regardless of when, why, or what they fly - Back to top Non Compis Mentis Guest Posted: Sat Jan 22, 2005 10:08 am    Post subject: Re: Aerobatics before PPL?? Read all the previous posts... Agree that you should keep current doing solos, etc. etc.and focus on getting the Navs done, because the YMMB training area does get tiresome after a while (well, when you're restricted to it, anyway). BUT, I chose to do some aerobatics (loops, rolls, spins, hammerheads) immediately after GFPT for two reasons: 1. It was great fun. 2. It taught me a lot more about flying than all the Navs and gave me a bit more confidence and respect of flying. I'd recommend it for reason 2, alone, but realise, it will eat into your cash that could be saved for doing your navs, further postponing your them and your PPL. So, unless you have reasons for doing it, keeping current is a lot cheaper and you can practice some manouvres they will ask of you during your PPL test. NCM. edcook24 wrote: Quote: I'm up to Navex 3 (8 months ago)at RVAC, Moorabbin and I've run low on cash. I'm toying with the idea of gaining an Aerobatics rating to improve my flying skills (and keep costs down) rather than continue with the Navs as I can only afford one every two months, what are peoples views on this idea? -- edcook24 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Posted via OziPilots Online [ http://www.OziPilotsOnline.com.au ] - A website for Australian Pilots regardless of when, why, or what they fly - Back to top lozza Guest Posted: Sun Jan 23, 2005 1:18 am    Post subject: Re: Aerobatics before PPL?? edcook24 wrote: Quote: Thanks to everyone who has responded with such valuable advice, very useful. -- edcook24 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Posted via OziPilots Online [ http://www.OziPilotsOnline.com.au ] - A website for Australian Pilots regardless of when, why, or what they fly - Good to see so many pilots keen to venture beyond straight & level! If you are still keen to go the aero route I still recommend emt as in my last response.I know it's a mandatary starting point before basic aerobatics with Action Aerobatics, I don't know what the others do. What you will learn is "what happens if I skid or slip in a climbing ,decending,level turn?What does a spin feel like?What will I do if I inadvertently find myself upside down?" Invaluable knowledge IMHO,as well as a hell of a lot of fun. Happy flying Laurie Back to top Display posts from previous: All Posts1 Day7 Days2 Weeks1 Month3 Months6 Months1 Year Oldest FirstNewest First         AirTalk.org Forum Index -> Planes, gliders and flying in Australia All times are GMT Page 1 of 1   Jump to: Select a forum Aviation----------------alt.aviationAviation safety EnhancementPlanes, gliders and flying in AustraliaAviation et pilotage (Français)rec.aviationAviation (Aerobatics)Hot air, gas balloons and airshipsHang-gliding, paragliding, foot-launched flightAircraft Design & BuildingInstrument Flight RulesAviation (Classifieds)Military AircraftNaval AviationAviation (Miscellaneous Topics)Owning AirplanesAviators (General Discussions)Aviation related productsAircraft RestorationHelicopters and rotary wing aircraftsFlight SimulationSailplanesAviation (Students)Light aircraftFlying related activities in the UK Airports----------------alt.airportsEdinburgh Airport Glasgow Airport Humberside Airport Luton Airport Aberdeen Airport Glasgow Prestwick Airport  You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2006 phpBB Group SEO toolkit © 2004-2006 webmedic.